Current Events > Harris is losing the Arab American vote .

(+) Yeah! (+)

LightSnake posted...

Okay, since I apparently need to explain this clearer, it is that Harris is going to be reticent to side fully against Israel and place herself with these people, because then the story is about why Harris is siding with open antisemites. Is that clear enough? Do you not understand this is beyond just "oh, she can take an anti-genocide stance?"

LightSnake posted...

Those 'fringe idiots' are now the face of the pro-Palestinian movement in America. Holy shit, the head of the largest Arab civil rights group in America, the American-Arab Anti-Discrimination Committee (Abed Ayoub) straight up admitted on twitter he worked with Holocaust deniers and defended them as "just anti Israel"

Do you not see this is much more complicated than just "I'm against genocide" with demographics, and how it'll be covered?

I'm sorry but I just can't take you seriously here in the slightest. The idea that Kamala can't take an anti-genocide stance because she'll get linked with the most extreme elements is just ludicrous. You seem to think she has no ability to control the narrative.

Kaitouace posted...

Harris has far more to lose by taking the Palestinian side

Except all the polling evidence shows that the opposite is true (see e.g. https://theintercept.com/2024/09/10/polls-arms-embargo-israel-weapons-gaza/ ).

I had an older Uber driver from Palestine yesterday.

he referred to Biden as "Genocide Joe", and said Harris was no different, but he at least acknowledged that Trump was worse.

tremain07 posted...

This is one of my biggest fears about Democrats once they get power, they'll do nothing then when people call them on it they'll immediately pivot to "Oh so you like dictatorship and fascists? " to shut it down, it's the same arrogance that caused Clinton to lose, Trump is a completely deplorable human being who is extremely ignorant of everything, you basically have no choice but to vote for me even if you don't like me, is the vibe a shitload of people got from Clinton and as a response they went "Fuck you, I'm voting for Trump because you bastards do nothing for me even if he does nothing for me at least this will teach you fucks a lesson to actually listen to us people instead of acting like you're owed our support just because the other option is a madman!"

In what reality does this happen?

Literally every Democratic administration for the last century has made changes or passed laws to improve lives. Literrally every single one.

Yeah, sure, Obama did nothing. Except pass huge improvements to the welfare state and healthcare reform. Biden gave every American 1400 bucks free of charge, passed an enormous infrastucture and social services bill and empowered labor beyond ever before but yeah, nothing.

tremain07 posted...

This is one of my biggest fears about Democrats once they get power, they'll do nothing then when people call them on it they'll immediately pivot to "Oh so you like dictatorship and fascists? " to shut it down, it's the same arrogance that caused Clinton to lose, Trump is a completely deplorable human being who is extremely ignorant of everything, you basically have no choice but to vote for me even if you don't like me, is the vibe a shitload of people got from Clinton and as a response they went "Fuck you, I'm voting for Trump because you bastards do nothing for me even if he does nothing for me at least this will teach you fucks a lesson to actually listen to us people instead of acting like you're owed our support just because the other option is a madman!"

I understand disliking democrats because they are often self serving and like to play to the center when they get power.

I cant comprehend the argument of i know this guy is objectively worse in almost every way and will make my life more difficult but im gonna teach everyone a lesson by voting him instead Thats self harm at best.

Enclave posted...

I'm sorry but I just can't take you seriously here in the slightest. The idea that Kamala can't take an anti-genocide stance because she'll get linked with the most extreme elements is just ludicrous. You seem to think she has no ability to control the narrative.

Harris has literally supported a ceasefire and stated the Gaza casualties are 'unconscionable.' That is evidently not enough, though.

But I'm sure there'll be no negative publicity to her saying "Israel is a rogue state committing genocide and I'll enact an arms embargo day one"

Fin_Dawg_004 posted...

64% of arab americans voted for Biden in 2020. Did they suddenly become anti-LGBTQ in the last 4 years? The palestine issue has been at the crux of the discussion reagarding the arab-american vote this entire election cycle, but "The_crow13" says no it's actually because theyre homophobic and they are the enemy. lol

the enemy is too harsh and I was mostly just responding to what that user said. My bad.

youre ignoring that anti-trans panic has grown tremendously since 2020 and you actually think that has nothing to do with this? If Palestine is an actual issue for the voters they would vote green or sit out, not switch to Trump.

https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/comments/1g9k20t/i_will_not_vote_for_genocide/

I saw this and felt like it was related to the discussion going on.

Enclave posted...

Like I've been saying, this could well cost Kamala the election. Of course a number of people on this board took offence to that statement, doesn't change it from being a very real possibility though.

All Kamala had to do was take a stance against Israels genocide but she just couldn't do it and now we may get Trump again. Of course the usual suspects here will somehow blame the left if that comes to pass.

Not every Arab American is voting Trump because of Gaza.

LightSnake posted...

Obama put healthcare as his top legislative priority over codifying Roe.

Please explain in your own words how Roe could have been codified and what being codified would've done with this Supreme Court.

Also, 'bare minimum?' Please inform us what each state that has enshrined abortion protection into law at the state level has in common, Brush

We can walk and chew bubble gum at the same time, especially since Obama claimed reproductive rights were a top priority during his campaign. Also, if codifying Roe would have done nothing, then what could democrats do on a national level? If they can't do anything and it's ultimately up to the states anyway, what's the fight about?

LightSnake posted...

Okay, since I apparently need to explain this clearer, it is that Harris is going to be reticent to side fully against Israel and place herself with these people, because then the story is about why Harris is siding with open antisemites.

Again, you're smearing a large and overwhelmingly anti-racist protest movement (a disproportionate number of whom are themselves Jewish) as antisemites.

LightSnake posted...

Those 'fringe idiots' are now the face of the pro-Palestinian movement in America.

They're the face you've chosen to paint in your own mind.

LightSnake posted...

Literally every Democratic administration for the last century has made changes or passed laws to improve lives.

OK, that's lovely, and the current one is still giving a genocidal regime money and weapons with which to commit mass murder.

LightSnake posted...

Harris has literally supported a ceasefire

Asking nicely for a ceasefire while pledging to keep giving weapons and money to a genocidal aggressor is not "supporting a ceasefire".

Turtlemayor333 posted...

Why didn't TC post the overall poll results from YouGov?

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/4/482cd9bb.png

Because CE is addicted to doomer slop like little cucks.

Is this the one where the crosstabs also showed them going for Trump over Hillary, which didn't happen?

LightSnake posted...

Harris has literally supported a ceasefire and stated the Gaza casualties are 'unconscionable.' That is evidently not enough, though.

But I'm sure there'll be no negative publicity to her saying "Israel is a rogue state committing genocide and I'll enact an arms embargo day one"

If she actually takes a position of withholding funding and weapons to Israel over this I absolutely think it would help her. Republicans will try to frame it as a negative but they do that anyways. There's absolutely support in the country for cutting off Israel from weapons right now, it's not a losing issue and your idea that her taking such a stance will immediately link her to the most extreme elements is as I said ludicrous. She can control the framing of her positions, she has a voice and can counter Republican misinformation on her positions.

Thanatos_the_Great posted...

Again, you're smearing a large and overwhelmingly anti-racist protest movement (a disproportionate number of whom are themselves Jewish) as antisemites.

There's no smearing about it. Many protesters are not antisemites. Unfortunately, there are many who are and many do not take a stand against them.

They're the face you've chosen to paint in your own mind.

No, it's the face that's been blasted over the news stations.

OK, that's lovely, and the current one is still giving a genocidal regime money and weapons with which to commit mass murder.

Okay, that had nothing to do with the post actually being responded to. Try and keep up. Or better yet, stick to you own country

Asking nicely for a ceasefire while pledging to keep giving weapons and money to a genocidal aggressor is not "supporting a ceasefire".

The Biden admin literally just threatened an arms embargo if conditions don't improve

Tmaster148 posted...

https://www.reddit.com/r/TikTokCringe/comments/1g9k20t/i_will_not_vote_for_genocide/

I saw this and felt like it was related to the discussion going on.

Three years ago, would you have imagined posting a video where someone downplays concerns about voting for a candidate who supports a genocide?

1337toothbrush posted...

We can walk and chew bubble gum at the same time, especially since Obama claimed reproductive rights were a top priority during his campaign. Also, if codifying Roe would have done nothing, then what could democrats do on a national level? If they can't do anything and it's ultimately up to the states anyway, what's the fight about?

Ignoring that conservatives are so powerful rn because they literally own the supreme court? If Mitch let Obamas pick go through then wed be living in a much different scenario. When one of the branches of the country is fully committed to one side it makes a bit harder to do.anything.

This is why dems are floating ideas of how to solve the supreme court problem were currently facing

cjsdowg posted...

Three years ago, would you have imagined posting a video where someone downplays concerns about voting for a candidate who supports a genocide?

Go ahead don't vote or vote 3rd party. Help Trump the guy who said he would help Israel win get elected.

Clearly that's the best option.

1337toothbrush posted...

We can walk and chew bubble gum at the same time, especially since Obama claimed reproductive rights were a top priority during his campaign. Also, if codifying Roe would have done nothing, then what could democrats do on a national level? If they can't do anything and it's ultimately up to the states anyway, what's the fight about?

Actually no. When it comes to passing major legislation, the options were pretty limited, because there was only so much that the Blue Dogs were going to allow at the time, and healthcare reform was a much, much bigger priority.

Also, the plan was "Keep The Supreme Court." If Roe had been codified, all things being equal? The Roberts court would've just gutted or killed the law like they did the Voting Rights Act, among other statues.

BunkerBoy posted...

Do they think Trump will treat them better? Mr Muslim Ban, bomb the middle east himself?

They are cutting off their own noses to spite their faces.

LightSnake posted...

Many protesters are not antisemites.

Yet you obsess over the insignificant minority who are.

LightSnake posted...

No, it's the face that's been blasted over the news stations.

This says more about where you choose to get your news from than anything else.

LightSnake posted...

The Biden admin literally just threatened an arms embargo if conditions don't improve

Oh, so now you support an arms embargo? You're giving off big "Comrade Napoleon is always right" energy.

LightSnake posted...

Obama put healthcare as his top legislative priority over codifying Roe.

And Harris is prioritising... fracking?

Tmaster148 posted...

Go ahead don't vote or vote 3rd party. Help Trump the guy who said he would help Israel win get elected.

Clearly that's the best option.

I am supporting a Harris, but at the same time pointing this way you guys have of just writing off legit issues isn't a good thing.

Thanatos_the_Great posted...

Except all the polling evidence shows that the opposite is true (see e.g. https://theintercept.com/2024/09/10/polls-arms-embargo-israel-weapons-gaza/ ).

I feel that's too risky with AIPAC ready to sabotage anyone who isn't lockstep with Israel. It's the same situation as with gun bans. The majority of Americans say they're all about common sense gun laws yet in the voting booths they pick the NRA zealots. If you could trust those kinds of polls (most people want "this good thing") then virtually no one would ever vote Republican.

Thanatos_the_Great posted...

Yet you obsess over the insignificant minority who are.

It's not really 'insignificant' and it's very telling the same people who push the "if one Nazi sits at a table with 9 people, you have ten Nazis" suddenly take the "we can't possibly root out the antisemites from our movement"

This says more about where you choose to get your news from than anything else.

That's still mainstream news sources in America

Oh, so now you support an arms embargo? You're giving off big "Comrade Napoleon is always right" energy.

I really have no more patience with you. You're never insightful or intelligent. You chime in on American politics for years, pretending you know anything about it when you're a British leftist who has been wrong about almost everything in his own country and refuses to even acknowledge it. You have no education on America, no knowledge of it and zero stake in it, yet you continuously pretend to be an expert while offering nothing of value.

Corbynites are some of the most ridiculous people in the entire political landscape. Some of the biggest political losses of the last decade but not a single one has ever taken a moment of self reflection and thinks they know best.

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

Ignoring that conservatives are so powerful rn because they literally own the supreme court? If Mitch let Obamas pick go through then wed be living in a much different scenario.

How would kicking the can down the road be "a much different scenario"?

IceCreamOnStero posted...

How would kicking the can down the road be "a much different scenario"?

Are you seriously asking why changing the makeup of the Supreme Court would change American politics?

Some over Palestine and others over being a woman in power.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

How would kicking the can down the road be "a much different scenario"?

This isnt a genuine question. It cant be.

Youre questioning how an Obama appointed justice that doesnt overturn settled law for the GOP is a much different scenario? Wed literally still have roe v wade right now.

DrizztLink posted...

Are you seriously asking why changing the makeup of the Supreme Court would change American politics?

Yes, I am asking why "Vote for [Bad candiate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2024 is a meaningfully different scenario to "Vote for [Bad candidate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2032

IceCreamOnStero posted...

Yes, I am asking why "Vote for [Bad candiate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2024 is a meaningfully different scenario to "Vote for [Bad candidate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2032

Well, yes? Every election is going to be "forward or backward." It's been that way for a long time now.

Something peope don't seem to understand is there's no way to just win politics. You're being asked to vote in 2024. You'll be asked to vote again in the 2026 midterms. And then again in the 2028 presidential.

And maybe even the 2027 special municipal election in your town. And then on and on, because our system works that way.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

Yes, I am asking why "Vote for [Bad candiate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2024 is a meaningfully different scenario to "Vote for [Bad candidate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2032

So your argument is this bad thing might just happen 8 years in the future so if it happens now its the same

dawg. Not to mention if any judges drop during another trump presidency then were not fixing that court for the rest of our lives.

IceCreamOnStero posted...

Yes, I am asking why "Vote for [Bad candiate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2024 is a meaningfully different scenario to "Vote for [Bad candidate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2032

Take it up with the guys trying to strip civil liberties.

In the meantime, I'll vote for the people who aren't planning to do that.

Sorry if that's complicated.

LeTigre posted...

Can we stop saying that disenfranchised people deserve a Trump administration because the DNC cant seal the deal?

You get what you vote for. What else do you expect?

LightSnake posted...

Well, yes? Every election is going to be "forward or backward." It's been that way for a long time now.

Something peope don't seem to understand is there's no way to just win politics. You're being asked to vote in 2024. You'll be asked to vote again in the 2026 midterms. And then again in the 2028 presidential.

And maybe even the 2027 special municipal election in your town. And then on and on, because our system works that way.

If people really cared about the election being more than "pick between 2 candidates" they would be focus on election reforms at the state level. Getting rid of the EC is a tall order given it needs a constitutional amendment whereas States changing how they assign ECs is something that can be done at an individual state level.

These individuals will vote in the presidential election and then proceed to ignore everything else which is why it's such a struggle for Democrats to have a House and Senate both Democrat majority to get a lot of things done.

DrizztLink posted...

Take it up with the guys trying to strip civil liberties.

In the meantime, I'll vote for the people who aren't planning to do that.

Sorry if that's complicated.

Im seeing a lot of the sides arent meaningfully different enough to matter at the end of the day all of a sudden here. I dont know why people need to contort themselves into a pretzel about the GOP controlled supreme court of all things

Tmaster148 posted...

If people really cared about the election being more than "pick between 2 candidates" they would be focus on election reforms at the state level. Getting rid of the EC is a tall order given it needs a constitutional amendment whereas States changing how they assign ECs is something that can be done at an individual state level.

These individuals will vote in the presidential election and then proceed to ignore everything else which is why it's such a struggle for Democrats to have a House and Senate both Democrat majority to get a lot of things done.

The big issues are people don't really vote on material outcomes. Can you save a Democracy from its own voters?

IceCreamOnStero posted...

Yes, I am asking why "Vote for [Bad candiate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2024 is a meaningfully different scenario to "Vote for [Bad candidate] because [Worse candidate] will strip basic civil liberties" in 2032

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/0/05e98b67.jpg

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

this is showing trump WINNING with this group. How would Kamalas israel stance make people who care about palestine vote for an even worse option

Even assuming this poll is worth a damn (Given it doesn't seem to share it's methodology...), it might not be so much they flipped and are voting Trump, as it is that those who would normally vote Dem are just sitting it out, this giving those who would normally vote Trump an outsized amount of representation.

I mean, that said, I wish they would not sit out, and I definitely think voting Trump is massively against any Arab Americans best interests.

It is definitely an emotional reaction for many to not vote at the very least, probably not the best thing, but if you were someone who had friends or family die in Gaza, and you see what the administration is enabling to happen to people like you, it isn't crazy to imagine why some might hesitate to pull the lever for Harris, especially since she has shown no real sign of breaking with Biden's policies.

It isn't pragmatic, nor logical, but it isn't crazy that those who are impacted might feel strongly about the issue.

And it's something that could have been partly remedied by Kamala pressuring Biden from behind the scenes, as well as publicly supporting better policy.

I think most Arab Americans who vote will still vote for Harris. I don't think the proportion of them voting FOR Trump will go up in any significant amount. The question has always been how many will stay at home or cast someone type of protest vote.

If it happens, it's the most predictable own goal of all time. I'm not convinced it will.

Lmao. This is leopards ate my face in reverse.

We truly deserve Trump.

It's just protest polling, in an election year while the Middle-East is at war.

Makes sense, but what are they gonna do, tote for Trump?

Thermador446 posted...

It's just protest polling, in an election year while the Middle-East is at war.

Makes sense, but what are they gonna do, tote for Trump?

Yes. It's a pretty big mistake to assume every Arab cares about Gaza.

No one to blame but herself. Hope courting the right instead of them works out for her.

Those people are dumb.

GuerrillaSoldier posted...

i love how the mindset of the topic is "they're wrong

This part is very much true.

PballDepot posted...

No one to blame but herself. Hope courting the right instead of them works out for her.

Theyre voting for the right tho

ssb_yunglink2 posted...

Theyre voting for the right tho

Probably, like I said hope her strategy works.

PballDepot posted...

Probably, like I said hope her strategy works.

Youre arguing that she courted the right too much despite the fact that this group is apparently voting for the right

how does that make sense

People upset that Harris is courting the right haven't been paying attention to the fact right leaving folks have been endorsing her while the far left like the uncommitted not only refuse to do so but also went out of their way to attack her and be annoyances.

Really not hard to figure out why she's working with the right on getting elected.