Current Events > Bernie to Voters Abstaining Over Israel: 'Trump is even worse'

(+) Yeah! (+)

1337toothbrush posted...

Ads would bring attention to Bernie, instead they worked their connections in media to shit on Bernie any time they had to talk about him. Dumb shit like "Bernie Bros" persists to this day. Also, the primary process is completely party controlled, so they worked their magic there too.

Bernie lost fair and square because at the end of the day, people voted against him in the primaries twice. Stop whining

LightSnake posted...

Bernie lost fair and square because at the end of the day, people voted against him in the primaries twice. Stop whining

Yes, the small fraction of people who actually vote in primaries (generally party diehards who dominate the party-controlled primary process) voted against him.

1337toothbrush posted...

Yes, the small fraction of people who actually vote in primaries (generally party diehards who dominate the party-controlled primary process) voted against him.

So he couldn't appeal to the people he actually needed to appeal to and thus lost

LightSnake posted...

So he couldn't appeal to the people he actually needed to appeal to and thus lost

Right, he couldn't appeal to wealthy corporate-friendly types and thus lost in the process controlled by them.

1337toothbrush posted...

Right, he couldn't appeal to wealthy corporate-friendly types and thus lost in the process controlled by them.

That's an interesting way of saying "he couldn't win over the primary voters." He got plenty coverage and his message didn't connect. Get over it.

LightSnake posted...

That's an interesting way of saying "he couldn't win over the primary voters." He got plenty coverage and his message didn't connect. Get over it.

I see you've chosen to simply ignore who most primary voters are, how small of the total population they make up, and that the primary process itself is controlled by the party. Sorry that you can't get over the facts, but that's what they are.

The primaries have remained the same, dude. He signed up to play by the rules, and couldn't win. That's on him

I like how the take away isn't that more people should be involved in the primaries to push the party to the left.

When the left doesn't care enough to get that involved into the politics of the party, it's not a surprise they aren't going to focus on catering to them.

LightSnake posted...

The primaries have remained the same, dude. He signed up to play by the rules, and couldn't win. That's on him

Okay, but that doesn't change the fact that the primaries heavily favor wealthy corporate-friendly candidates. If you don't see why that's a problem then I don't know what to tell you.

1337toothbrush posted...

Okay, but that doesn't change the fact that the primaries heavily favor wealthy corporate-friendly candidates. If you don't see why that's a problem then I don't know what to tell you.

This is just cope and on some level, you know it

LightSnake posted...

This is just cope and on some level, you know it

The real cope is thinking money doesn't play an outsized role in US politics. Also, don't tell me what I do or do not "know".

1337toothbrush posted...

Okay, but that doesn't change the fact that the primaries heavily favor wealthy corporate-friendly candidates. If you don't see why that's a problem then I don't know what to tell you.

Biden actually had less money when party leaders rallied around him. It's wild how badly he was doing.

Diceheist posted...

Biden actually had less money when party leaders rallied around him. It's wild how badly he was doing.

What part of "He just won South Carolina decisively after polling well there for months and was ahead in the southern states" refuses to sink in for you?

If Bernie had received Clyburn's endorsement in the same exact circumstances, the Sanders campaign would've touted it through the rooftops til the end of days. Bernie's literal, exact strategy was "win a minority of votes with a divided field," so don't give me this nonsense that people dropping out to endorse someone else was unfair

"Oh, but Bernie waas ahead!" Yeah, and Democrats had mentioned for years the Iowa Caucus (which Pete Buttigieg factually won, btw) that leading with two small, white states had no real bearing on the actual electorate. Biden beat Elizabeth Warren in her own state and was viable in Vermont. the guy was much stronger than he was given credit for and if Sanders' campaign didn't realize that, that's on them

Diceheist posted...

Biden actually had less money when party leaders rallied around him. It's wild how badly he was doing.

Which is why the turnaround was so stark. They got Clyburn's endorsement, managed to eek out a lead in a state that didn't even go to democrats in the general (but rewarded them this year for that favor by pushing their state ahead in the primary schedule), and ran with it. They got their buddies in media to pump out story after story about the "Biden miracle", got all the other candidates to drop out and rally around him, and used a PAC for Warren to stay in the race and split primary votes with Bernie. It's amazing what can be done if you have the party backing you in the party-controlled primary process.

1337toothbrush posted...

Which is why the turnaround was so stark. They got Clyburn's endorsement, managed to eek out a lead in a state that didn't even go to democrats in the general (but rewarded them this year for that favor by pushing their state ahead in the primary schedule), and ran with it. They got their buddies in media to pump out story after story about the "Biden miracle", got all the other candidates to drop out and rally around him, and used a PAC for Warren to stay in the race and split primary votes with Bernie. It's amazing what can be done if you have the party backing you in the party-controlled primary process.

Southern Black voters are one of the biggest voting blocs for the Democrats, it's wild to see you still dismissing that after years

LightSnake posted...

Southern Black voters are one of the biggest voting blocs for the Democrats, it's wild to see you still dismissing that after years

Tell me, which candidate won South Carolina in the general election of 2020?

LightSnake posted...

What part of "He just won South Carolina decisively after polling well there for months and was ahead in the southern states" refuses to sink in for you?

He was polling ahead in those states but not nearly as well as he actually performed after Clyburn's endorsement.

Furthermore it's bizarre to use states that always vote Republican as the end-all be-all to begin with.

LightSnake posted...

If Bernie had received Clyburn's endorsement in the same exact circumstances, the Sanders campaign would've touted it through the rooftops til the end of days.

And it'd have been just as tacky.

Winning a state off the back of a local leader's endorsement is a fluke and should not be used to presume future performance in other states without such a figure's support (where the campaign is not pollling to win nearly as decisively). Yet despite knowing that party leaders used the event to manifest a self-fulfilling prophecy.

LightSnake posted...

Bernie's literal, exact strategy was "win a minority of votes with a divided field,"

That was everyone's strategy, considering how they were pledging to contest the convention even if Bernie went in with more delegates. Biden is just lucky that he alone got bailed out of having to use the strategy.

LightSnake posted...

so don't give me this nonsense that people dropping out to endorse someone else was unfair

It's not unfair if they choose to do so, it's debatably unfair for them to be pressured to do so (akin to how Biden was pressured to drop out this year).

1337toothbrush posted...

Tell me, which candidate won South Carolina in the general election of 2020?

are Black Dems in SoCal voting for Trump? No? Okay then. But which other primaries did Biden win? Very blue Massachusetts? Michigan? Wisconsin? Pennsylvania?

Diceheist posted...

He was polling ahead in those states but not nearly as well as he actually performed after Clyburn's endorsement.

Boo hoo.

Furthermore it's bizarre to use states that always vote Republican as the end-all be-all to begin with.

Keep whining about the most loyal Democratic constituencies having a say in who the nominee is.

And it'd have been just as tacky.

Don't believe you, sorry.

Winning a state off the back of a local leader's endorsement is a fluke and should not be used to presume future performance in other states without such a figure's support (where the campaign is not pollling to win nearly as decisively). Yet despite knowing that party leaders used the event to manifest a self-fulfilling prophecy.

It's not a fluke. That's literal politics. you're just mad it didn't go your way.

That was everyone's strategy, considering how they were pledging to contest the convention even if Bernie went in with more delegates. Biden is just lucky that he alone got bailed out of having to use the strategy.

That was not, in fact, everyone's strategy. Most would say "we plan to win the majority." Bernie's campaign folks literally said they planned on the Black vote to be split.

It's not unfair if they choose to do so, it's debatably unfair for them to be pressured to do so (akin to how Biden was pressured to drop out this year).

Politics without pressure doesn't exist.

1337toothbrush posted...

No, because I don't make excuses for democrats even though I'm voting for them. That wasn't so hard, was it?

NOBODY HAS ASKED YOU TO MAKE EXCUSES FOR DEMOCRATS. All anyone has done is point how that Trump was objectively worse, and all your responsive have been But GENOCIDE, BOTH SIDES SAME.

You are so full of shit you could be legally classified as a fertilizer factory.

1337toothbrush posted...

Right, he couldn't appeal to wealthy corporate-friendly types and thus lost in the process controlled by them.

Thats a strange way of describing his failure to appeal to black voters in the south.

LightSnake posted...

"Oh, but Bernie waas ahead!" Yeah, and Democrats had mentioned for years the Iowa Caucus (which Pete Buttigieg factually won, btw)

It's odd how people who readily bring up Trump losing the popular vote then lean on Buttigieg winning Iowa, when he similarly lost the popular vote, despite winning the contest under extenuating circumstances (Bernie and Warren were pulled from campaigning for the Trump trial, so Buttigieg had an unusual advantage there).

LightSnake posted...

Keep whining about the most loyal Democratic constituencies having a say in who the nominee is.

They have a "say" when their state votes. But the party should not coalesce around a candidate based on that state alone. That's spitting in the face of the other 49.

LightSnake posted...

Don't believe you, sorry.

What you believe isn't particularly relevant. There are people who initially supported Harris who cooled off after she started parading around Cheney's endorsement. Similar thing here. Personally I'd have been suspicious of whatever concessions Bernie had to make to get a heavily corporate politician like Clyburn's endorsement, when even Obama didn't get it.

So are we still pretending Dicey isnt an obvious troll?

McMarbles posted...

So are we still pretending Dicey isnt an obvious troll?

Projection. You just tried to make a discussion regarding the primary about race. Even though Bernie has generally been supportive of civil rights and equitable policies.

Diceheist posted...

Projection

"i know u are but what am i," Apocalypse Edge said

Compare the substance and topicality of the above post to the substance and topicality of the previous post.

Diceheist posted...

Projection. You just tried to make a discussion regarding the primary about race. Even though Bernie has generally been supportive of civil rights and equitable policies.

He marched with KING!

Diceheist posted...

Compare the substance and topicality of the above post to the substance and topicality of the previous post.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/8/865fc7e0.jpg

DrizztLink posted...

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/8/865fc7e0.jpg

No, I'm posting about the discussion in this topic while you're doing drive-by mockery and baseless accusations.

McMarbles posted...

He marched with KING!

Does Bernie support socially liberal policies, yes or no?

If yes then it's bizarre how you're holding his relationship with minority voters against him. They're allowed to prefer other candidates without it being some indictment of him personally.

Diceheist posted...

No, I'm posting about the discussion in this topic while you're doing drive-by mockery and baseless accusations.

And they're equally relevant, I'm not trying very hard and you're a walking punchline.

Diceheist posted...

It's odd how people who readily bring up Trump losing the popular vote then lean on Buttigieg winning Iowa, when he similarly lost the popular vote, despite winning the contest under extenuating circumstances (Bernie and Warren were pulled from campaigning for the Trump trial, so Buttigieg had an unusual advantage there).

Popular vote is meaningless in a caucus, and all but impossible to measue regardless. The Sanders campaign promoted cucuses because they felt it was to their advantage and they lost the first one. "But he won the popular vote" there is just cope.

They have a "say" when their state votes. But the party should not coalesce around a candidate based on that state alone. That's spitting in the face of the other 49.

So Nevada and the polling in the other states just didn't exist?

What you believe isn't particularly relevant. There are people who initially supported Harris who cooled off after she started parading around Cheney's endorsement. Similar thing here. Personally I'd have been suspicious of whatever concessions Bernie had to make to get a heavily corporate politician like Clyburn's endorsement, when even Obama didn't get it.

Bernie's campaign literally insulted Clyburn. It turned him from a neutral figure into endorsing Bernie's biggest threat. Unforced error.

FFS, your country is going to fuck this up. Trump doesn't just fuck over your country, he'll fuck us all over.

But I guess some will be able to stand smugly proud as they watch others lose their rights, suffer, and die. Oh, and watch even worse happen in the Middle East.