Current Events > Article on Schumer's upcoming book where he discusses 'antisemitism on the left'

(+) Yeah! (+)

Doe posted...

The material difference is whether you're claiming Schumer receives orders from the state of Israel

LightSnake posted...

okay, understand I am not calling you antisemitic. I am saying you made a bad statement. And youve been doubling down on it. It was clearly inadvertent and I said youre often a very good poster.

this is emblematic of the very issue a lot of us are discussing. You dont need to posit a Jewish senator voted badly on a continuing resolution because Israel ordered it.

I still don't see how it's such an outrageous and unrealistic accusation at least in some cases. I didn't even say it was 100% a true thing, but there's a possibility that Israel could have influenced him. He takes money from a PAC in the name of another country. He takes money from other places too. He was doing a book tour for money before he got protested and he cancelled it. Like I said, he and other Dems are too worried about their own wealth so they can ride out Trump's doings. I still don't see how Israel has absolutely no influence in AIPAC either.

I hate to keep repeating myself, but I feel it needs doing. If this were about any other person and any other country, I feel there wouldn't be this back and forth. Nobody argues that Republicans aren't in Russia's pocket for example. This is about political corruption, not Jewish people and anti-Semitic stereotypes.

LightSnake posted...

There is a double standard on the Left that Israel is seen as a reflection of Jews and thus all Jews bear the blame for it.

Israel/Zionism is a reflection of the lasting impacts of British imperialism more than anything else.

There are plenty of anti-Zionist Jewish people in the world that it'd be stupid AF to blame Jews as a whole.

Southernfatman posted...

I still don't see how it's such an outrageous and unrealistic accusation at least in some cases. I didn't even say it was 100% a true thing, but there's a possibility that Israel could have influenced him. He takes money from a PAC in the name of another country. He takes money from other places too. He was doing a book tour for money before he got protested and he cancelled it. Like I said, he and other Dems are too worried about their own wealth so they can ride out Trump's doings. I still don't see how Israel has absolutely no influence in AIPAC either.

I hate to keep repeating myself, but I feel it needs doing. If this were about any other person and any other country, I feel there wouldn't be this back and forth. Nobody argues that Republicans aren't in Russia's pocket for example. This is about political corruption, not Jewish people and anti-Semitic stereotypes.

Yes, if we weren't dealing with Jews, it would change the equation there. The issue is a very specific accusation of political corruption revolving around that....a not inconsiderate part of antisemitic stereotypes revolve around accusations of political corruption and nefariously pulling strings.

There aren't that same history with Russia, or a history of oppression upon Russia. In fact, that was an accusation in Russia against the Jewish minority.

Like...Netanyahu is a corrupt, genocidal, warmongering monster. Claiming that is antisemitic is ridiculous and deflection. But the accusation that Israel is giving Chuck Schumer marching orders on unrelated votes is where it gets to be a bit much

LightSnake posted...

Like...Netanyahu is a corrupt, genocidal, warmongering monster.

Should always be emphasized that it's not because he's Jewish. He's just an asshole.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


https://jacobin.com/2015/01/united-states-saudi-arabia-isis/
https://jacobin.com/2023/02/islamophobia-anti-muslim-racism-history-empire
https://jacobin.com/2019/09/france-insoumise-islamophobia-racism-melenchon-pena-ruiz

There's a bunch more, just FYI.

Starks posted...

Should always be emphasized that it's not because he's Jewish. He's just an asshole.

Yep. Just, as pointed out, people impute Israel upon the Jewish people as a whole. A lot. Netanyahu is taken to be that representative.

LightSnake posted...

https://jacobin.com/2015/01/united-states-saudi-arabia-isis/
https://jacobin.com/2023/02/islamophobia-anti-muslim-racism-history-empire
https://jacobin.com/2019/09/france-insoumise-islamophobia-racism-melenchon-pena-ruiz

There's a bunch more, just FYI.

Isn't there a difference between acknowledging that the reported conduct of Islamic countries influences Islamophobia, and arguing whether it is correct to be Islamophobic or not?

need new leadership

You have my permission to purchase the book.

LightSnake posted...

Yes, if we weren't dealing with Jews, it would change the equation there. The issue is a very specific accusation of political corruption revolving around that....a not inconsiderate part of antisemitic stereotypes revolve around accusations of political corruption and nefariously pulling strings.

There aren't that same history with Russia, or a history of oppression upon Russia. In fact, that was an accusation in Russia against the Jewish minority.

I understand where you're coming from, but that's not where I was going with all of that. Israel can engage in corruption just like any other country and they can engage in things that bigots see as a strictly Jewish act.

Like...Netanyahu is a corrupt, genocidal, warmongering monster. Claiming that is antisemitic is ridiculous and deflection. But the accusation that Israel is giving Chuck Schumer marching orders on unrelated votes is where it gets to be a bit much

Like with Netanyahu, it's not because he or Schumer or any corrupt member of the Israeli government are Jewish, it's because they're assholes. That's what I've been meaning.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


And I'm saying the Left is far more willing to push back on imputing Muslim extremism to peaceful Muslims than they are when it comes to Israel.

The actions of Muslim states and terror entities create Islamophobia. Israel's actions lead to antisemitism. We can agree on that. I am saying many leftist spaces are far quicker to defend Muslims from it being justified, whereas Jews are often held to loyalty tests before they are seen as worthy of being defended against antisemitism. I don't think that's very controversial to say when we saw many groups defending picketing synagogues, community centers or Holocaust memorials on the basis of "well, many Jewish institutions ARE Zionist," whereas I have rarely, if ever, seen any Leftists defend the harassment of Mosques. Rightfully so

Southernfatman posted...

I understand where you're coming from, but that's not where I was going with all of that. Israel can engage in corruption just like any other country and they can engage in things that bigots see as a strictly Jewish act.

Of course it can. That doesn't mean it's paying Schumer for shutdown votes, though. I understand it's not where you were going with, but there is something to be said for accidentally saying something off color.

Like, we're not talking on Israel paying Jonathan Pollard to spy on the US here. People keep alleging Epstein was Mossad and all his human trafficking was a plot by Israel to entrap the rich and famous. Entrapping people is something Intel agencies do, but I don't think I need to elaborate on how "Epstein Was Mossad' is pretty easy to connect to pretty classic antisemitism.

Like with Netanyahu, it's not because he or Schumer or any corrupt member of the Israeli government are Jewish, it's because they're assholes. That's what I'm meaning.

And I'd agree, Schumer can be an asshole without being paid by Israel to make bad votes. Like Virginia Foxx isn't a vehemently pro-Israel psycho because Israel's paying her, it's because she's a right wing conservative Christian who views Israel as necessary for her theology.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


Okay, so consider yourself elucidated.

One reason you are so unbelievably obnoxious is you are one of the most hands down combative and nasty people on this board who is almost always the person to initiate insults. Whenever anyone answers in kind, you immediately claim to be the victim and go into sputtering outrage. It's unbelievably trying

Doe posted...

Isn't there a difference between acknowledging that the reported conduct of Islamic countries influences Islamophobia, and arguing whether it is correct to be Islamophobic or not?

Yes, and perhaps I made my point poorly here. But I am saying leftist spaces are quicker to justify antisemitism as a natural occurrence and put the onus on Jews to oppose Israel to prove they don't deserve antisemitism

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


The guy who pretended Palestine was a huge issue for him and throwing shrieking fits at anyone who dared to question that only to completely drop the subject when Trump one is talking about gimmicks and consistency.

This is an ongoing thing. You act like a complete asshole to everyone and then whimper how wounded you are when anyone responds in kind. Your gimmick sucks, and so does pretending you are in any way involved in activism beyond posting online because you need an outlet. You have no right to talk about honesty or integrity.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

Yeah, condemning KSA and acknowledging its damage to perception of Muslims isn't really gonna be a hot take in most places. That dude is full of shit

LightSnake posted...

Yes, and perhaps I made my point poorly here. But I am saying leftist spaces are quicker to justify antisemitism as a natural occurrence and put the onus on Jews to oppose Israel to prove they don't deserve antisemitism

I think that "leftist spaces" are more apt to expect nuance and the changing of someone's values and judgements when new information is presented to people. The whole thing about leftists being progressive and right being conservative.

Not to suggest that either position is inherently right or wrong, rather than leftist ideologies usually expect others to be vocal and actively change things when something terrible is transpiring. To be active, not passive.

Gwynevere posted...

Yeah, condemning KSA and acknowledging its damage to perception of Muslims isn't really gonna be a hot take in most places. That dude is full of shit

Now tell me how many of those groups kept putting the onus on Muslims in those instances. Holy shit, this isn't difficult

LightSnake posted...

Yep. Just, as pointed out, people impute Israel upon the Jewish people as a whole. A lot. Netanyahu is taken to be that representative.

This is why I always say 'Netanyahu's war crimes', or 'the Israeli government's ethnic cleansing'.

There are many Jewish people and organizations protesting for Palestine.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


"It's just a blatant lie!" And yet your posting about Gaza has all but vanished. You were sneering at people who claimed the situation could possibly be worse, only to twiddle your thumbs and mumble a token condemnation at the proposed mass ethnic cleansing.

You just freak out because knowing you're a fraud bothers you. You have enough self awareness for that, but not to actually conduct yourself with any integrity. You wouldn't even give up lunch, let alone sacrifice for anything.

LightSnake posted...

Now tell me how many of those groups kept putting the onus on Muslims in those instances. Holy shit, this isn't difficult

Putting the onus on Muslims to do what, exactly?

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


Congrats, you've shown more acknowledgment of the actual issue than many others on the Left, where it's seen as "natural" to conclude antisemitism is flourishing and can't so much as condemn it without mentioning Israel.

Do you have anything you believe in on a moral level except so you can pat yourself on the back? You throw fits any time you're caught not really giving a shit about human suffering. I don't think you're stupid, Shock. I do think you're a malicious fraud.

Gwynevere posted...

Putting the onus on Muslims to do what, exactly?

Be the ones to denounce the actions of terrorists and bad actors? Some of the same people saying that asking "do you condemn Hamas' as a prerequisite for being free of bigotry were saying it was good for Jews to be asked to disavow Israel.

Thus far I actually believe you care about this, unlike Shock, who only pretended to until Trump was elected.

I know a lot of left-ers can't believe it, but there's absolutely some legit antisemites hiding on their side. It's usually easier to camp out in the right wing for most racists, but pro Palestine sentiments make a more than effective cloak for antisemite grifters to conceal their true intentions.

darkbuster posted...

I know a lot of left-ers can't believe it, but there's absolutely some legit antisemites hiding on their side. It's usually easier to camp out in the right wing for most racists, but pro Palestine sentiments make a more than effective cloak for antisemite grifters to conceal their true intentions.

They exist for sure, but it's not the epidemic bad actors like LightSnake acts it is.

It's far more common for anti-Zionists to be accused of being antisemitic than for genuine antisemitism.

genuinely who the fuck wants to read a chuck schumer book? i'd rather watch paint dry

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


we know about the Nazis on the right. We kind of need spaces on the left to be Allies at the same time.

ultimate_reaver posted...

genuinely who the fuck wants to read a chuck schumer book? i'd rather watch paint dry

I mean, I have an Al D'Amato book for decoration. I would not buy a Schumer book for even that.

LightSnake posted...

we know about the Nazis on the right. We kind of need spaces on the left to be Allies at the same time.

You say this but you get really angry at criticism of the democrats, I've seen you "but Republicans are way worse" when people (rightfully) shit on the dems from the left. This doesn't feel like a genuine response even if I agree with the idea behind it (though do think the amount of antisemitism on the left is widely overblown).

El_Dustino posted...

You say this but you get really angry at criticism of the democrats, I've seen you "but Republicans are way worse" when people (rightfully) shit on the dems from the left. This doesn't feel like a genuine response even if I agree with the idea behind it (though do think the amount of antisemitism on the left is widely overblown).

I have engaged in a lot of that same criticism recently. Schumer' action durin the shutdown were terrible. I do find some criticism from the let to be antifactual and unfair, and some of it to be fair.

I agree antisemitism is worse and more dangerous on the right,but there's a lot on the Left and other leftists tend to brush it off, downplay it, etc. Especially when they don't personally experience it

LightSnake posted...

I have engaged in a lot of that same criticism recently. Schumer' action durin the shutdown were terrible. I do find some criticism from the let to be antifactual and unfair, and some of it to be fair.

I agree antisemitism is worse and more dangerous on the right,but there's a lot on the Left and other leftists tend to brush it off, downplay it, etc. Especially when they don't personally experience it

People are talking about abandoning the trans community because of sports stuff, and we had Newsom roll over and glaze an actual Nazi on the subject on his own podcast.

It's been brushed off on this very board.

It's not exactly out of character for some of the Brownie Point leftists.

DrizztLink posted...

People are talking about abandoning the trans community because of sports stuff, and we had Newsom roll over and glaze an actual Nazi on the subject on his own podcast.

It's been brushed off on this very board.

It's not exactly out of character for some of the Brownie Point leftists.

If it helps, Newsome's slimeball act has been falling flat and he's less popular because of it.

Chuck Schumer is a fucking ghoul

Think of a name and you'll probably be right, I'm not interested in digging into the archive to double-check

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

I remember a recent tire fire here where someone who should damn well know better was advocating for throwing trans people under the bus.

That may be what Drizzt is referring to.

LightSnake posted...

we know about the Nazis on the right. We kind of need spaces on the left to be Allies at the same time.

Kind of like how establishment dems need to be allies to more than their own?

LightSnake posted...

Be the ones to denounce the actions of terrorists and bad actors? Some of the same people saying that asking "do you condemn Hamas' as a prerequisite for being free of bigotry were saying it was good for Jews to be asked to disavow Israel.

Thus far I actually believe you care about this, unlike Shock, who only pretended to until Trump was elected.

I'm mostly confused about the relevance of this line of questioning because I haven't seen Jews being expected to openly disavow Israel in leftist spaces, so why would Muslims be expected to disavow KSA?

This whole thing just reads as tilting at windmills and I think very few people view your argument in a positive light