Lurker > Wanglicious

Ashethan posted...

This is why we have to work SUPER HARD to get out the vote in 2022. We can't be politically apathetic ever again.

that's exactly what a return to normal is though. people want sleepy joe and that's basically gonna be what they get, right to republicans getting both houses in 2022 with a pitch of "take our country back."

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

that depends, jakyl.
libs have the option of crying or not, it's a hard decision.
progressives, socialists, and commies can all laugh because they ain't liberals but somehow they keep being lumped with libs, to their benefit and libs' detriment.

so enjoy the laughter.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

red sox 777 posted...

Has the House been called yet? Congress is the final judge of the election returns, but it seems the law is if the two houses of Congress disagree whichever set of electoral votes is certified by the state's governor controls. Which is a Democrat in every one of the remaining battleground states except Arizona.

not yet but dems are expected to barely keep a majority. if the clock gets run yeah, biden wins.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Inviso posted...

Genuinely...what, in the GOP's actions, specifically the Senate GOP who ignored the CARES Act for months and spent October dealing with forcing ACB onto the court, makes you think they give a shit about getting people stimulus money? They don't care. If they cared, they could have easily pushed for a better compromise than the meager scraps they threw out, which would have tremendously benefited the party. But they don't care. And if you're Mitch McConnell, the worst case scenario is the Dems swing the Senate 52-48. That's not the end of the world, especially since I don't know if the Dems WOULD eliminate the filibuster.

Maybe I'm cynical, but the GOP has given me no reason to think they would trade a social program (giving people free money) for electoral advantage. I think they would much rather risk losing the election if it meant keeping those purse strings pulled tight. And it worked out for them. I see absolutely no reason to believe we're going to get ANY stimulus now, because they can pin ANY failure on Biden (most likely) and the House, meaning they don't have to budge an inch on the already-anemic proposal they've offered up.

most of the GOP would hate to do it. at the same time, their democratic opponents would straight up just run ads telling the voter base "if you vote for me i will literally throw money at you that this guy won't." that's why it'd be suicide, they may not like to vote on it but it's extremely popular in all demographics and many seemed like they'd be in close races. either the bill dies with them, putting a sword over their heads, or people get a notable stimulus - it's win/win.

the turtle just plain didn't want to vote on it and got away with it.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

the standard on this one is simple.
if you're gonna do some seriously scummy shit where you play politics, you'd better fucking win. what you're doing is wrong but you're accepting that risk in favor of a greater goal. if they won the house they would've totally gone for a $2.5 or $3 trillion stimulus. at least, i'd like to think so.

but if you don't win, you fucked up. if you've also lost seats in the process, you really fucked up.

to simplify it: if playing politics, only the conclusion matters. and she really shouldn't have, nobody wants to wait 3 more months on a maybe. the dems who called her out on it were right.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

i mostly agree. push comes to shove, i think they pass it because the alternative is suicide. i just can't completely discount them committing suicide. either way, trump should've called his bluff because as it stands the best person republicans had for stimulus was, somehow, Mnuchin. the fucking state of the party right there.

edit:
Inviso posted...

Honestly? I feel like if she took Trump's deal, the ONLY way she comes out of that with even SORT OF a win is if Mitch was forced to pass it (which I don't think he would've gone for.) If Mitch (likely) rejects the deal, then the message becomes "Nancy and the Democrats are weak. They buckled under pressure and the GOP STILL rejected their compromise."

i just think it's suicide for them to not pass it. if they don't, it becomes a major campaign target for the last 2 weeks of the election. more importantly, it gets people money in mid October, maybe early November, as opposed to 3 months later. fuck the politics there, it's just the right thing to do.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Inviso posted...

I'm glad that even you can see just how much of a scumbag Mitch McConnell (and by extension the GOP that elect him to represent him as Senate Majority Leader) is with regards to the stimulus.

i've hated mitch for a long time, you can go back in the topics and see that if you really care to but really, it's mitch, should go without saying.
the man is uncannily good at his job, to a level that he legit is a top 5 senate majority leaders of the past century. he's also a shit.

Corrik7 posted...

A lot of this is on Pelosi. Freshman Democrats begged her to take a deal with Trump because their seats were in jeopardy. I think 7 or some of them have lost now. They lost seats in the House now.... Pelosi didn't do so banking on having the Trifecta. Now it looks like she will NOT have the trifecta and have less seats in the House. While letting the Senate off the hook of blame for the stimulus failing.

She justified people suffering not getting aid because "we will get an even package when we take over". And now they aren't even. They made people suffer for nothing.

oh she absolutely should've taken the deal. it was $1.8 trillion, she asked for $2.2, take the 80%. she absolutely should've said yes to that deal and let it senate decide to kill it, let them take the brunt come election day. she totally fucked up and Yang is vindicated once again...!


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

pezzicle posted...

I'd argue that they reason they don't like him has more to do with how much he rocks the boat.

Rich people want the status quo to remind the same. Trump just wants power and part of that is money, but part of that is fame and respect from a portion of the population. So he has doubled down on his base. It does discord in the country and creates economic volatility, something billionaires don't want.

that makes sense, though it just means he's 'one of them' while not exactly being one of them and they can't stop him. if he's out of office, should definitely be easier, even if they have to pay slightly more as they'll get more chances to make more money too.

Corrik7 posted...

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/11/04/election-2020-mcconnell-says-stimulus-will-be-senates-top-priority-before-end-of-2020.html

what a crock of shit.
like the balls on this man, he's actually going to try to push his half trillion proposal isn't he? and it's not like the dems are gonna have any leverage on this either since they've got less people in the house and won't have the senate.

he's legit gonna make the 2021 play being "we TRIED to pass this stimulus before trump left but then biden came in and now we can't work together, oh no."


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

pezzicle posted...

How is trump bought the least when he IS a billionaire. He couldn't be more on the team.

which is why his policies totally favor them too. they've totally gained more profits with trump. yet at the same time they don't actually favor him. not by funding, not by internal emails we've seen, not by business calls/notes we've seen, it's kind of bizarre. he's in that group but they hate him. his funding doesn't come from them and he doesn't seem to listen to them that much, he only cares if the stock ticker goes up.

granted, a lot of these documents that we've seen did assume it would be a biden presidency and a democratic senate. i don't think they were so ready for this situation but uh... honestly this works for them too. as usual, no matter who wins, they get the profits.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Clark County, Nevada's confirmed they won't be complete until the 12th.
that PS4 launch date looking pretty stacked!

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

i think it's largely a mix of his rhetoric with the people who hate him the most.
wall street quite hates him, despite the fact that his policies favored them well. the super wealthy generally align in that way and lined up hard behind biden.

neither party is good against them, both are bought and paid for. trump probably bought the least but his policies still favored them, with the exception of dealings with China. admittedly, that might be it for many. the only other option would be because trump puts the spotlight on them more than they'd like.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

also some of them just plain forgot to upload the votes. completely serious, it's what georgia's secretary of state said.

https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/1324403659845894145

you already know THAT one is running straight into the conspiracy checkbook.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

main reason they don't want to is because doing so means calling the election for biden. they're just purposefully NOT doing that.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Jeb! is somewhere in a corner glad he didn't win because this ain't his mess.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

sharpie one was super widespread and had a mix of people.
it doesn't change all that much from what's going to happen mind you - hand count will be demanded and used.

but as it stands what's being done right now is people are mostly looking at every possible infraction that could have happened and blowing it up. most have occurred one way (favoring Biden) so you see more of it in that direction but eventually i'm sure we'll see more from the opposite side, though much more quietly and likely tied to mail in votes.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

well great.
expect the upload thing to also be met with a lawsuit somewhere too, then. it's something when a fake excuse every college student has used for a term paper is literally the same excuse used in a presidential election.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

it's not day drinking if you're on a 72 hour day~

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Corrik7 posted...

Democrats supposedly are going to file a lawsuit because 155,000 ballots came in late in Georgia and they want to count them despite not being allowed by their state laws.

is this the recent report about counties that forgot to click upload?
as i'm reading that right now and it's like oh c'mon, how do you make this look even more sketchy.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

pezzicle posted...

Oh for sure it's not great. But in Canada we have three main parties and then 2 minor parties and they are all fairly different from each other

yeah... over here we literally had a group of "former republicans" endorse biden and it worked pretty well for them. really, after 47 years it's pretty fair to say biden presidency would fall somewhere between Clinton and Bush. he ain't going to be running a lot of it either, he'll largely defer to DNC and donors and they generally fall in that in-between as well so it works out. Harris is a snake that'll have no problem conforming to what they want to either. little will actually be different but it'll sound nicer while fundamentally changing almost nothing.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

from what i remember in this topic political compass isn't just not perfect but it's massively flawed.
but that said yes, the two aren't that different in many places. hell, trump is more anti-war.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

it's fully in recount territory anyway, so whatever we get won't be the proper total.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

can't believe fur is literally murder now.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

you can also get more non-SC judges with 50 senators too. most will still pass but this does give the gop something to obstruct with whenever they feel like it.

though yeah the biggest thing would definitely be the ability to put bills on the floor.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

masterplum posted...

I think a Red senate is going to end up better for democrats then 50-50 senate. I think they pick up a bunch of seats in 2022 instead of a red counter wave hitting them

i'll again point to the house, because it's not just the senate. quick google check says 204/190, D/R.
dems lost 5 seats, possibly more.
gop gained 6 seats, possibly more. i don't think they're at risk of losing anything anymore and i think general expectations are up to 10. there's a very real chance it's almost 50/50 in the house, slight nod to dems.

with results like this, they will 100% be emboldened in 2022 because in that year they'll have a very real chance to own both houses of congress.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Jakyl25 posted...

I choose to blame this on the Lincoln Project

They motivated Republicans to vote against Trump! Oh and while they were there they probably voted red down ballot

Lincoln Project is by far the worst thing in this race.
there's a good part of me that believes Biden is going to be closer to Bush because of them. both parties would be far better off without any of these people latching on, neocon hawks like them can make their own damn party.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

pezzicle posted...

I legit don't get how people don't see thru this

Like, it's seems so obvious

honestly this time around i don't think that mask is gonna be on either: a significant chunk of republicans won't see biden as legitimate, they'll view the obstruction as defending america. it's part of the loop we're in now where republicans try to obstruct dems, dems obstruct the gop, and everything spirals worse with people in the middle kind of going how the winds blow.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

it ain't just the senate, dems lost a number of house seats as well. think GOP is up 6, dems down 5, with a couple more still being decided to see if dems lost more? congress as a whole is a lot tighter.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

i mean even if he's forced to do it because of the hypocrisy, court challenges can take time and unless there's an outright injunction the answer is take the court loss and the 1-2 years you get, which sets it right up for the 2022 election.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

more votes got found in Georgia.
as of 8:30AM, there's 50-60k uncounted ballots remaining, up from 25k.

so the noon deadline may be pushed back to count for that still.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Waluigi1 posted...

How so? Seems like it'll be the same just with more data.

two fronts i'm aware of.
the first would be that due to the speeds it may be easier to hide and gather much more data.
more importantly however it's the makers of the infrastructure in the majority of winning bids: China. reason to believe they're trying to push for massive, global data collection.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

ABC never called AZ. that rumor was either 1) some right wingers saw it posted as blue on the map but not called and mistakenly though it was retracted, or 2) twitter trolls.

and i'm assuming trump got away with the acting director crap entirely because he had the senate. personally am still of the position that limiting the executive is a good thing and should be priority, not using illegal expanded powers. i doubt that's gonna happen since every new executive loves the power they got.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

RaidenGarai posted...

It's so weird that our President doesn't understand how voting works. It's like he's a moron or som... Oh. Wait.

it's not that he doesn't understand, it's that it's what his lawyers are telling him to do to win. these declarations are lawyer-advised trump with entire point to tie them up. no question of standing, no issue of "you conceded but then took it back," and potentially try to have their electoral votes stuck in a legal limbo. it's all a preemble to the supreme court challenge for all of those states.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

by ONE second x.x
you win this round, Stud.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

weird trump tweet because it's clearly done with lawyers. for legal purposes, trump is calling PA, GA, NC, and... has an odd qualifier for MI but basically is calling that too.

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1324108200141082624

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

charmander6000 posted...

Unless a state is decided by hundreds of votes it's quite unlikely things will change barring uncovering fraud.

oh i totally agree that what we get will generally be the result. some differences will pop up but i don't think it'd make anything.

but they're gonna ask for recount by hand, guaranteed. especially for arizona considering the sharpie thing keeps coming up and republicans will lean on that hard if they don't come out ahead.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

_stingers_ posted...

I thought we were supposed to know AZ tonight

probably them too, yeah.
i mean for all these instances this is before recounts are called, and that's before double checking for double votes happens, so don't expect a proper winner for another week. probably around the time NC is expecting next week when it's all said and done.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

i'll pick the side less likely to kill me.
normally this is where being white hispanic pays off but right now i don't think that's particularly helpful!

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

Nevada today*
they accelerated it. i believe we're expecting PA and NV tonight.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

No, one is opening the door to be wrong, the other is literally priming supporters to feel justified in a civil war my guy!

bluntly, both sides are primed for a civil war. it's the results that matter, not how it's said.
that's kinda the fucked status we're in right now. it isn't going to go "well, i guess he was wrong" because his declaration of victory was surrounded by "I think I've got it." it's gonna be "fuck that other guy, burn it down."

like, you know. people in this very topic series have said.
i'm not particularly interested in pretending the mask hasn't come off in here, that shit left back in June man. not you specifically, iirc you weren't one of them. but people aren't going to take that difference in phrasing as something to matter in the face of the result. whoever wins will have the loser's side on edge for civil war.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

LordoftheMorons posted...

https://twitter.com/annalise_frank/status/1324079313176678402?s=21

that one's the Detroit one, i think.
personally don't see it as bad as the attempts to stop PA because 1) literally detroit, pretty safe bet it's biden majority, and 2) i believe the PA attempts are more directly tied to trump.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

ChaosTonyV4 posted...

One guy said I won, anything that makes me lose is fraud

Other guy says: I think I won, this is why

Wang: These are the same.

on the sense that they're both saying "I won"?
uh, yeah. they are.
the messaging is different, the conclusion is the same.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

yep.
pretty silly too, they want to stop the count in PA but they want the count to continue in AZ. pretty blatant bullshit.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

StartTheMachine posted...

He's declaring that everything is lining up for him to win, but since he's not a fascist, he won't claim victory until every vote is counted. Pretty simple.

ah, that's the messaging behind the words. that makes more sense.
...i'm not sure how it's actually different mind you, word for word he said "it's clear that we're winning enough states to reach 270...", that's pretty blatantly declaring victory, regardless of what's said after. but if that actually works for a subsection of the population to meaning "i'm not that guy!" then alright, makes sense.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

well no, he said he thinks he's got 270 but then said he's not declaring victory, then got into why he thinks he's got 270. so not declaring victory, but that he thinks he's got the victory. which is silly.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

so biden is basically saying he's declaring victory right now, but not declaring victory. he's... declaring that he thinks he's declaring victory?

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

biden speech first it seems.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

yeah, posted that a bit ago. they're counting in NC.
they just have no intention of releasing the numbers until the 12th or 13th.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

trump's claiming PA, expected to have a speech soon.
later tonight, biden is to have a speech too.

this day may well end with both claiming they won PA.

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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

https://twitter.com/AndySpecht/status/1324075436477947907

NC won't be known until November 12th/13th. so we've got over a week before that one clears.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.

maybe biden's incoherence is because an alien queen laid eggs in his brain and is in control.


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"Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.