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Board 8 > Anagram's D&D Game - Topic 666

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Anagram
04/05/12 3:08:00 PM
#1:


Fightan
Talkan
Kanzan

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IhatethisCPU
04/05/12 3:09:00 PM
#2:


http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=372565

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Accel_R8
04/05/12 3:09:00 PM
#3:


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Sceptilesolar
04/05/12 3:09:00 PM
#4:


http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=380117

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KanzarisKelshen
04/05/12 3:11:00 PM
#5:


http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=355889

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Tirofog
04/05/12 3:14:00 PM
#6:


http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=374487

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SovietOmega
04/05/12 3:18:00 PM
#7:


http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=363019

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Accel_R8
04/05/12 10:27:00 PM
#8:


Vanessa Wishlist
Strongheart Tattoo (Level 8, Adventurer's Vault 2)
Pennant Helm (Level 14, Adventurer's Vault 2)
Incendiary Ring of Fireblazing (Level 14, Mordenkainen's Magical Emporium)
Ring of Feather Fall (Level 14, Adventurer's Vault)
Feystep Lacings (Level 12, Adventurer's Vault)
Gauntlets of Blood (Paragon Tier) (Level 14, Adventurer's Vault 2)
Crimson Determination (Boon) (Paragon Tier) (Level 14, Dragon Magazine 393)
Southern Star Cleave the Boulder (Boon) (Paragon Tier) (Level 14, Dragon Magazine 403)
Stone of Earth (Level 12, Adventurer's Vault 2)
Handy Haversack (Level 10, Player's Handbook)

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Sceptilesolar
04/05/12 10:30:00 PM
#9:


As of today Amy achieves a new milestone in NPC enraging.

http://porkcutlets.files.wordpress.com/2007/09/goodjob.png?w=500

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Anagram
04/06/12 12:09:00 AM
#10:


Sceptilesolar posted...
As of today Amy achieves a new milestone in NPC enraging.

http://porkcutlets.files.wordpress.com/2007/09/goodjob.png?w=500

Telling a grieving mother that she should have died with her daughter to avoid having to feel guilt will do that.

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Anagram
04/06/12 12:10:00 AM
#11:


Okay guys, post whom you think will be the final boss. I already said in the chat that the final boss I have planned (subject to party derailing) is someone you've already met. Kan's guesses were

Raita, Amy, Winter, Queen, HotB Boss, Ephestral, Teracor, Rael, Vivi

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 1:35:00 AM
#12:


Wishlistin':

-Badge of the Berserker +3, Adventurer's Vault 2.
-Backlash Tattoo, Adventurer's Vault 2.
-Defensive Step Training, Dungeon Master's Guide 2.
-Battle Standard of the Hungry Blade, Dragon 381
-Power Jewel, Adventurer's Vault.
-Pitted Flowstone, Heroes of the Elemental Chaos.
-Mad Monkey Wobbles, Dragon 404.
-Five Stars Five Strikes, Dragon 404.
-Cincture of the Dragon Spirit, Adventurer's Vault 2.

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 9:56:00 AM
#13:


I think Ephestral is the most likely candidate, all in all.

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Anagram
04/06/12 11:53:00 AM
#14:


Sceptilesolar posted...
I think Ephestral is the most likely candidate, all in all.

But why? Other than that she's Rael's top minion.

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 12:01:00 PM
#15:


I dunno. Blame my latent psychic abilities.

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Tirofog
04/06/12 12:41:00 PM
#16:


Here are my thoughts on final boss stuff, based on the characters I've seen:

Rael - He is the "obvious" choice for final boss, but in a campaign with this many twists, turns, and otherwise derailings, I would be very surprised if this ended up being the case.

Vivi - She has the motives now to be a final boss, but I think she'll likely show up again later as a midboss of some kind.

Amy - Depending on what CPU ends up doing with his new character, I could maybe see this one. I'd lean towards no, though, just because I can't see Amy doing anything so irredeemably evil that the party would have to kill her.

Teracor - She feels like the party betrayed her, and I could maybe see this leading to bigger things.

Raita/Winter - I can't really see either of these barring a dramatic heel turn. Raita backstabbing Teracor could be a sign of things to come, though.

Ephestral/Queen - Haven't seen enough of these two to really judge, sorry.

Thoron/Forget - If Anagram wants to make the party cry.

Dubs - Comedy option.

tl;dr - I have no idea. >_>

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 12:46:00 PM
#17:


Anagram as good as confirmed Rael as non-option yesterday, unless he's planning on genderbending.

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IhatethisCPU
04/06/12 12:51:00 PM
#18:


New character? ...Did something happen when I logged out yesterday? >_>'

And I'm not going to guess. <_<'

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 12:53:00 PM
#19:


Oh. Did you miss that part? Yes, Omega's temporarily retiring Amy, possibly for a Monk.

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IhatethisCPU
04/06/12 1:27:00 PM
#20:


No, no, saw the temp retirement, was briefly worried at the use of his, is all. <_<'

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Anagram
04/06/12 5:18:00 PM
#21:


IhatethisCPU posted...
No, no, saw the temp retirement, was briefly worried at the use of his, is all. <_<'

I think he just mistyped "CPU" where he meant "Omega."

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Accel_R8
04/06/12 7:40:00 PM
#22:


Accel's TOP 10 NPCs
Note: I'm excluding NPCs sitting in limbo until they reappear in the story proper since, for all we know, Vivi's story could be a lie. Y'never know.

1. Miss R
2. Forget
3. Samantha
4. Eren
5. Teracor
6. Reen
7. Saya
8. Asabew
9. Ederax
10. Atharathes

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Anagram
04/06/12 7:42:00 PM
#23:


Accel_R8 posted...
Accel's TOP 10 NPCs
Note: I'm excluding NPCs sitting in limbo until they reappear in the story proper since, for all we know, Vivi's story could be a lie. Y'never know.

1. Miss R
2. Forget
3. Samantha
4. Eren
5. Teracor
6. Reen
7. Saya
8. Asabew
9. Ederax
10. Atharathes

Oh God, Asabew over Vivi?

What have I doneeeeeeeee

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Accel_R8
04/06/12 7:48:00 PM
#24:


I have a slight bias towards the NPCs that make me laugh over the NPCs that are just kind of... evil. There's nothing wrong with Vivi she's just taken a new role which is less entertaining, though she fills the role well enough.

Edit: Saya is officially a sort of anomaly, her inclusion primarily because, as somebody said, a legitimately helpful AND powerful NPC is a nice and interesting change.


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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 9:44:00 PM
#25:


Oh yeah, and I totally forgot:

-Imperial Oration, Dragon 393 Legendary Boon.

Because it's high goddamn time you learned how to speechify dudes, Valerian.

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Anagram
04/06/12 9:56:00 PM
#26:


Accel_R8 posted...
I have a slight bias towards the NPCs that make me laugh over the NPCs that are just kind of... evil. There's nothing wrong with Vivi she's just taken a new role which is less entertaining, though she fills the role well enough.

Edit: Saya is officially a sort of anomaly, her inclusion primarily because, as somebody said, a legitimately helpful AND powerful NPC is a nice and interesting change.


She's evil because she blames the party for her sister's death and her own torture? But alright, I see where you're coming from there.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 10:01:00 PM
#27:


From: Anagram | #026
Accel_R8 posted...
I have a slight bias towards the NPCs that make me laugh over the NPCs that are just kind of... evil. There's nothing wrong with Vivi she's just taken a new role which is less entertaining, though she fills the role well enough.

Edit: Saya is officially a sort of anomaly, her inclusion primarily because, as somebody said, a legitimately helpful AND powerful NPC is a nice and interesting change.


She's evil because she blames the party for her sister's death and her own torture? But alright, I see where you're coming from there.


She's evil because she's justifying her selfish desires with false pretenses, and taking a path that will harm creation out of a sense of hollow satisfaction. It's a bit deeper than that.

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 10:09:00 PM
#28:


There aren't any false pretenses involved. I'd call her misguided rather than evil.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 10:18:00 PM
#29:


From: Sceptilesolar | #028
There aren't any false pretenses involved. I'd call her misguided rather than evil.


If you can't call what she told herself to justify her actions lies...well...

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 10:27:00 PM
#30:


That we (directly) caused her sister's death and (indirectly) caused her to be tortured? Not seeing the lie yet.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 10:51:00 PM
#31:


From: Sceptilesolar | #030
That we (directly) caused her sister's death and (indirectly) caused her to be tortured? Not seeing the lie yet.


No, not that. Looking toward the future, not the past.

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Anagram
04/06/12 10:53:00 PM
#32:


Well what else did she lie about, specifically?

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 11:02:00 PM
#33:


Kan is just conflating 'opposed to the party' as 'irredeemably evil' for some reason, let's pay him no mind.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 11:02:00 PM
#34:


From: Anagram | #032
Well what else did she lie about, specifically?


Just to clarify, she didn't lie to us - but to herself. Those are the false pretenses she's under.

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 11:05:00 PM
#35:


No she didn't. She wants us dead because she hates our guts. As she said, it's a matter of vengeance. There's no self deception.

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Accel_R8
04/06/12 11:08:00 PM
#36:


No, Vivi as she told us, is invariably Neutral Evil.

Point: She wants to bring back Rael because she LIKES serving him because she LIKES all the cool things that he gives her. This is motivation to forsake the world because of GREED.

Point: She is willing to commit to the murder of several individuals because she believes they are the root of her problems. Yes, perhaps Amy did some dick things that got Vivi in major trouble, and yes, perhaps the decision to reboot the universe erased her loved ones. She is also very much willing to kill those people ASSOCIATED with the group that had absolutely no say in what was done (Vance) or more or less had their hands forced/they were otherwise coaxed into the decision they made (Kirie, Brona).

Vivi is very evil. Oh, and a choice little quote, "YOU WILL BE RAPED LAST, VANCE". Yeah.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 11:10:00 PM
#37:


From: Sceptilesolar | #035
No she didn't. She wants us dead because she hates our guts. As she said, it's a matter of vengeance. There's no self deception.


Yes, this is all true, but I'm not talking about that, but rather what she expects to get out of it. Unless her motivation is really cartoonishly simple ('to see you all dead'), then she's not going to get what she wants out of bringing Rael back. There's also that whole little speech she gave us about 'being the servant to the worst tyrant ever is the dream job', which implies a colossal lack of empathy...and empathy is the thing that defines goodness in D&D, and arguably in real life too (though this is a much more complicated subject since so much goes into our concept of goodness, while D&D's is much simpler).

EDIT: Accel kinda ninja'd me and said it better while at it. That's the size of it.

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Accel_R8
04/06/12 11:11:00 PM
#38:


Oh also I saw this on /co/ and it made me laugh. I over 9000 hours in MS Painted T'horon and Vance onto the spectrum. lol.

external image

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 11:11:00 PM
#39:


No, Vivi as she told us, is invariably Neutral Evil.

Alignments aren't a good judge of anything, and furthermore she's clearly Chaotic.

Point: She wants to bring back Rael because she LIKES serving him because she LIKES all the cool things that he gives her. This is motivation to forsake the world because of GREED.

Did she actually say that? I have a very bad memory, but that seems out of character. I know the artificer cultists did, but I got the impression Vivi wanted to bring back Rael to spite us.

Point: She is willing to commit to the murder of several individuals because she believes they are the root of her problems. Yes, perhaps Amy did some dick things that got Vivi in major trouble, and yes, perhaps the decision to reboot the universe erased her loved ones. She is also very much willing to kill those people ASSOCIATED with the group that had absolutely no say in what was done (Vance) or more or less had their hands forced/they were otherwise coaxed into the decision they made (Kirie, Brona).

Acknowledged, but she wasn't even there to know these particular points. All she knows is that the party was responsible.

Vivi is very evil. Oh, and a choice little quote, "YOU WILL BE RAPED LAST, VANCE". Yeah.

All you've really proven is that she's Chaotic Angry.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 11:14:00 PM
#40:


From: Sceptilesolar | #039
No, Vivi as she told us, is invariably Neutral Evil.

Alignments aren't a good judge of anything, and furthermore she's clearly Chaotic.

Point: She wants to bring back Rael because she LIKES serving him because she LIKES all the cool things that he gives her. This is motivation to forsake the world because of GREED.

Did she actually say that? I have a very bad memory, but that seems out of character. I know the artificer cultists did, but I got the impression Vivi wanted to bring back Rael to spite us.

Point: She is willing to commit to the murder of several individuals because she believes they are the root of her problems. Yes, perhaps Amy did some dick things that got Vivi in major trouble, and yes, perhaps the decision to reboot the universe erased her loved ones. She is also very much willing to kill those people ASSOCIATED with the group that had absolutely no say in what was done (Vance) or more or less had their hands forced/they were otherwise coaxed into the decision they made (Kirie, Brona).

Acknowledged, but she wasn't even there to know these particular points. All she knows is that the party was responsible.

Vivi is very evil. Oh, and a choice little quote, "YOU WILL BE RAPED LAST, VANCE". Yeah.

All you've really proven is that she's Chaotic Angry.


Paraphrase of Vivi, which is really really close to what she said: 'I've got magic, immortality, friends, enemies...what else could a girl possibly want?'. Yes, she said as much. This is seriously a really close quote scep - I can fish for the exact quote if you want.

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 11:15:00 PM
#41:


That sounds sarcastic. Perhaps bitter.

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Accel_R8
04/06/12 11:15:00 PM
#42:


Greed is genuinely NOT GOOD no matter which way you swing it. Greed on a scale that deprives others is infallibly evil. Vivi is greedy.

Wrath is chaotic. There is no law in unbridled wrath. Vivi wants the party to suffer. Vivi is wrathful.

Greedy in her life's goals and wrathful in her motivation, she is NOT good.

At best she is Neutral Evil, and at worst she is Chaotic Evil.

Vivi is evil.

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 11:18:00 PM
#43:


Greed is genuinely NOT GOOD no matter which way you swing it. Greed on a scale that deprives others is infallibly evil. Vivi is greedy.

But of the seven deadly sins Greed is invariably depicted as the most positive... Quibble aside, I already denied greed as a primary motivation.

Wrath is chaotic. There is no law in unbridled wrath. Vivi wants the party to suffer. Vivi is wrathful.

Which I agreed with.



Also, in retrospect, an interesting potential motivation for her wanting to summon Rael would be if he promised to recreate her sister somehow; that's probably not outside the realm of possibility for him.

In any case, I think it's far from clear-cut that she's outright evil.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 11:21:00 PM
#44:


From: Sceptilesolar | #041
That sounds sarcastic. Perhaps bitter.


Adam Sokol (20:44:47): "Now, I want you to know this for two reasons."
Adam Sokol (20:45:37): "The first is that I enjoy serving the Master. I legitimately do! I'm immortal, I'm powerful, I have friends, I have enemies, I have everything a girl could ever ask for. So yes, if I'm his toy, it's because I choose to be, because he offers to much to his toys."
Adam Sokol (20:45:42): "Now the second is this."
Adam Sokol (20:46:28): Vivi looks at the floor before looking up. "I bet you didn't know that I had a sister." She smiles. "She was much younger than me. So much younger, in fact, that because I'm immortal, I just told her that I was her mother. I doted on her, and the reason I let you take Learrette off of my hands was because I wanted to spend more time with her. She was smart, beautiful, and away from Rael, and I liked it that way."

This is the quote. So no, I doubt it. You don't go from sarcasm to talking about the reason you're out for blood. It was heartfelt, just a minor thing compared to the death of her sister.

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Accel_R8
04/06/12 11:22:00 PM
#45:


What was her motivation BEFORE the universe reset? Sure she had her sister/daughter but really now, her entire characterization up until this point depicts a greedy individual.

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 11:26:00 PM
#46:


This is the quote. So no, I doubt it. You don't go from sarcasm to talking about the reason you're out for blood. It was heartfelt, just a minor thing compared to the death of her sister.

No, that was actually kind of sarcastic or bitter, as I read it. But also probably a true sentiment. But I'm pretty sure we have a good friend in our crew who also used to be motivated by greed to join up with Rael. What was her name? Raita? No, I must be thinking of someone else, there's no crewmember by that name.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 11:29:00 PM
#47:


From: Sceptilesolar | #046
This is the quote. So no, I doubt it. You don't go from sarcasm to talking about the reason you're out for blood. It was heartfelt, just a minor thing compared to the death of her sister.

No, that was actually kind of sarcastic or bitter, as I read it. But also probably a true sentiment. But I'm pretty sure we have a good friend in our crew who also used to be motivated by greed to join up with Rael. What was her name? Raita? No, I must be thinking of someone else, there's no crewmember by that name.


I don't see how this changes things though? Just because Raita turned a new leaf doesn't mean she stopped having a bloody past. Similarly, you're not going to catch me arguing that Valerian's actions were good and just when he helped detonate an universe - they were just the *least bad*. What Vivi is doing is one of the worst possible things you could do, and not with good intentions either. She's acting evilly. She's not doing this to see her daughter resurrected either, which would make it misguided as you said - she just wants to watch us burn.

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Accel_R8
04/06/12 11:33:00 PM
#48:


Raita was always depicted as a rabid fangirl devoted to Queen, once she was cast away from that and had nothing else she left, I don't see the greed there.

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Sceptilesolar
04/06/12 11:33:00 PM
#49:


From: Accel_R8 | #048
Raita was always depicted as a rapid fangirl devoted to Queen, once she was cast away from that and had nothing else she left, I don't see the greed there.


Huh? I don't remember that. My memory really is terrible, then. Actually, I don't even know what Raita's motivations WERE; I just assumed it was the generic one.

From: KanzarisKelshen | #047
I don't see how this changes things though? Just because Raita turned a new leaf doesn't mean she stopped having a bloody past. Similarly, you're not going to catch me arguing that Valerian's actions were good and just when he helped detonate an universe - they were just the *least bad*. What Vivi is doing is one of the worst possible things you could do, and not with good intentions either. She's acting evilly. She's not doing this to see her daughter resurrected either, which would make it misguided as you said - she just wants to watch us burn.


That's NOT one of the worst possible things, though. It's relatively minor. That's party-centric morality there.

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KanzarisKelshen
04/06/12 11:35:00 PM
#50:


From: Sceptilesolar | #049
[quoted text]

Huh? I don't remember that. My memory really is terrible, then. Actually, I don't even know what Raita's motivations WERE; I just assumed it was the generic one.

[quoted text]

That's NOT one of the worst possible things, though. It's relatively minor. That's party-centric morality there.


Uh

Trying to bring Rael back is not one of the worst possible things you could do? What IS, then?

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