Board 8 > Suor ranks 105 pokemon with write-ups - THE TOP HALF - No more Feralolators!

(+) Yeah! (+)

Well Gen I is easily the best one for Fire types, all the ones from Charizard to Arcanine are in my top 100.

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Yeah, I think all the way down to Rapidash it's top 100 territory for me. But again, I love me some Fire types, so... >_>

They've gotten a little better about Fire in recent generations, but not by enough. Gen III, which I actually really do enjoy, was probably the worst offender for sure though. "Well it's Hoenn, so... if you want a Fire type, just get a couple more Water types instead, OK? ;)"

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Eh, they don't even make many Fire pokémon anymore besides starters, and the few they do are pretty Meh.

If there's one type for which Gen 1 Nostalgia is not only justified but completely right, that's Fire.

Btw no update today, were out the whole day for an exam and will catch up with True Blood at a friend's house, celebtrating my success with Pam and some wine.

Enjoy your day boys and girls!

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Fire is one of my least favorite types, especially the overrated nostalgia of the fire pokemon from gen 1. I'd always be stuck using Moltres after each play through because I had pokemon blue so no arcainine (a decent looking pokemon but I liked moltres a lot more). I always thought ninetails, rapidash, and flareon were really girly and went with squirtle as my starter everytime over the overrated firebreathing dragon.

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Gen 1 Fire types:

Arcanine >>>>> Vulpix > Growlithe > Ninetales > Charizard > Rapidash > Charmander > Ponyta > Charmeleon > Moltres >>>>> Flareon >>>>>>>>>>> lolmagmar

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Aww yeah Noctowl gogogogo

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*Notowel

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Noctowelette would be a great HootHoot nickname if not for letter restrictions.

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Honestly? I can't remember what I used for a fire type on my first play through. I remember using a Blastoise starter on Red.... maybe a Rapidash or something? I mostly remember my Blastoise plowing through everything though.

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Aww, I lost to SuperNiceDog, Winner of the Rivalry Rumble Guru Contest

Hey guys!

Got my old computer data back yesterday, which means that there might be a swift bonus 649 ranking after this is done!

Geee, I'm amazing.

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SuperNiceDog won the Guru contest super nicely!

Oh man I can't handle TWO 649 ranking lists at once! Wait until hobo finishes his imo.

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Oh I didn't notice hobo was doing one. I wasn't going to make a full topic for that or make comments, besides I remember now why I hadn't posted it: two pokémon are missing and honestly I don't feel like going through 647 guys trying to understand who's not there. I think I will just post the top 100 for a comparison and call it a day :P.

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GenesisSaga posted...

Gen 1 Fire types:

Arcanine >>>>> Vulpix > Growlithe > Ninetales > Charizard > Rapidash > Charmander > Ponyta > Charmeleon > Moltres >>>>> Flareon >>>>>>>>>>> lolmagmar

Dammit, Gen, stop posting your horrible opinions about Flareon.

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It's so useless though! In a generation full of so many awesome fire types (and also Magmar) it's completely outclassed in everything except cuteness, and as much as I hate to admit it, "cuteness" doesn't win battles!

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but ALL of Gen 1's Fire types suck in battle lol

From: blindhobo13 | #366

but ALL of Gen 1's Fire types suck in battle lol

Moltres and Charizard didn't until broken stealth rock came along...

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Arcanine has never sucked in battle, lol. And it gets better with every generation unlike poor Flareon who only gets more sad. I'm not even a fan of the thing, but GameFreak really needs to stop leaving it in the dark. It's kind of depressing now...

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A bunch of fire types have passable stats like Arcanine, Rapidash, etc. but they all have pretty poor movepools so they have been outclassed for a long time. Fire types are just not that good when compared to other Pokemon. In-game they're fine (because everything is) but competitively none of them were anything to get excited over until Infernape came along.

And yeah, Flareon is probably the best example of a Pokemon crippled by its limited movepool. I mean, one of the optimal sets had it running Iron Tail. Iron Tail

Well now, if there's department where Arcanine isn't lacking that's movepool. Typing and stats are probably what hold it back.

Infernape is good because, besides having STAB fighting moves and a good movepool, it also has extreme offensive stats, which are what design a "good pokémon" in this new metagame.

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SuorGenoveffa posted...

Well now, if there's department where Arcanine isn't lacking that's movepool. Typing and stats are probably what hold it back.

Typing, yes. Pure Fire is terrible in a competitive setting and there's nothing that can be done about that. V_V

Arc's stats and movepool are pretty decent though.

And yeah Stealth Rock has essentially dug Charizard and Moltres' graves. XD

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I love how they didn't change Stealth Rock's mechanics in Gen V despite being clearly and undisputably the dumbest idea ever.

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I ran a Champion Blue team on Pokemon Online forrr months. Let me tell you, in battles, Gyarados > Alakazam > Arcanine > Rhydon > Pidgeot > Exeguttor.

Gyarados and Alakazam were my powerhouses, Arcanine was useful miostly because people never saw close combat and wild charge coming.

I can't tell you how many Gyarados Arcanine electrified for me.

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I can definitely buy Alakazam being one of the most valuable members of your team, but Gyarados? Dragon moves, yes but dat 4x weakness to Electric!

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Fennec... :3
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Gyarados is way too good to submit to a mere 4x weakness.

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It's 8x weak to my fists

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From: GenesisSaga | #374

I can definitely buy Alakazam being one of the most valuable members of your team, but Gyarados? Dragon moves, yes but dat 4x weakness to Electric!

Gyarados has been one of the most dominant forces in competitive play since Advance. I can't count the number of times I've swept entire unprepared teams after just two DDs.

Welp I haven't played competitively since Crystal so I wouldn't know! It just seems like the odds are stacked against it based on its type. Really should've been Water/Dragon.

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GenesisSaga posted...

I can definitely buy Alakazam being one of the most valuable members of your team, but Gyarados? Dragon moves, yes but dat 4x weakness to Electric!

Gyarados is not afraid of a lot of guys capable of using Electric attacks after one Dragon Dance (it's not really used for Dragon moves besides that one). It's been much better and much more dominant than Alakazam in the last two generations.

I wasn't joking when I said that Feraligatr is basically a bad Gyarados!

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Interesting!

Suor buddy, you ranking today? :3

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I don't think Gyara even gets any offensive Dragon moves. THe only decent one I can even think of is Outrage.

Oh it does get Outrage via Move Tutor in BW2

GenesisSaga posted...

Interesting!

Suor buddy, you ranking today? :3

Most likely, yes.

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Iono Suor, from what these others are implying being a bad Gyarados is still being better than a lot of things.

Hobo how is Meganium?

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Feraligatr is better than Meganium now.

Back in Gen II though, Meganium > Feraligatr IMO because Feraligatr was not a bad Gyarados then, it was a bad Water pokémon among 3763 Water pokémon.

Meg was at least an average/slightly above average Grass type.

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SuperNiceDog won the Guru contest super nicely!

Except Water is much superior to Grass, so it evens out anyway.

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Gen, Gyarados is water/flying because if it had been water/dragon in RBY, it would have been as ridiculous as RBY Mewtwo. Back then, the only dragon move was that thing that always does 40 damage, so it would have no weaknesses and extremely high stats.

That said, Gyarados' weakness to electric moves was actually a good thing for me in Pokemon Online. The trick is to switch Gyarados into something that you know can't functionally harm it, preferably something like Heatran or Metagross, and while the opponent switches to something with an electric attack, use dragon dance. You're now faster than anything except Deoxys-S and things with choice scarf, and no one uses choice scarf on electric pokemon because they're usually already damn fast.

If the enemy switches into an electric pokemon, you use earthquake. If they switch into a Zapdos (or Emolga), you use stone edge. If they switch into something else, you use whatever is most appropriate. My Gyarados ran DD/earthquake/stone edge/waterfall. My team had no ice moves, which was admittedly a huge problem, but Gyarados with only one DD could destroy almost anything - very few things can handle all three of those attack types, the most common problem I encountered was multiscale Dragonite.

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Some_Character posted...

Except Water is much superior to Grass, so it evens out anyway.

Except that being a slow Water type with high physical stats, mediocre special stats, a bad in-game movepool and no STAB is honestly terrible compared to almost every single Water type back then. Thinking about it, Feraligatr has always been a bad Gyarados, even back when Gyarados was meh.

Meganium could at least use screens, Seed shenaingans, Swords Dance and more stuff I don't remember now. In-game, Body Slam and early Razor Leaf >>> Not a single useful move for the entire game.

Feraligatr was so bad that the chance of fishing something better than it with any rod, in any pool of water, was extremely high. So, what would be the point?

Gen II starters were all bad, but at least Meganium and Typhlosion were not entirely outclassed at what they do by almost every pokémon with their typing.

I remember arguing with my pals at school a long time ago about Feraligatr vs. Starmie, they were like "HURR Feragator is bettahr" and I was like "XMFD".

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Your pals were dumb.

Feraligatr is not and has never been better than Starmie, but at least it has a f***ing face!

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GenesisSaga posted...

Your pals were dumb.

Feraligatr is not and has never been better than Starmie, but at least it has a f***ing face!

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Well no wonder Suor likes Starmie so much.

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From: Anagram | #387

Gen, Gyarados is water/flying because if it had been water/dragon in RBY, it would have been as ridiculous as RBY Mewtwo. Back then, the only dragon move was that thing that always does 40 damage, so it would have no weaknesses and extremely high stats.

That said, Gyarados' weakness to electric moves was actually a good thing for me in Pokemon Online. The trick is to switch Gyarados into something that you know can't functionally harm it, preferably something like Heatran or Metagross, and while the opponent switches to something with an electric attack, use dragon dance. You're now faster than anything except Deoxys-S and things with choice scarf, and no one uses choice scarf on electric pokemon because they're usually already damn fast.

If the enemy switches into an electric pokemon, you use earthquake. If they switch into a Zapdos (or Emolga), you use stone edge. If they switch into something else, you use whatever is most appropriate. My Gyarados ran DD/earthquake/stone edge/waterfall. My team had no ice moves, which was admittedly a huge problem, but Gyarados with only one DD could destroy almost anything - very few things can handle all three of those attack types, the most common problem I encountered was multiscale Dragonite.

There are somethings you still don't outspeed after 1 DD I'm pretty sure. Like Starmie. And I always run Taunt set.

And Advance Gyara > all other iterations for me. HP Flying <3.

Man Meganium sucked too. And I love Chikorita line. I've only used it for a bit in Advance but lol at HP Grass being the strongest Grass move then without having to resort to Solarbeam.

Probably the worst starter competitively.

blindhobo13 posted...

From: Anagram | #387

Gen, Gyarados is water/flying because if it had been water/dragon in RBY, it would have been as ridiculous as RBY Mewtwo. Back then, the only dragon move was that thing that always does 40 damage, so it would have no weaknesses and extremely high stats.

That said, Gyarados' weakness to electric moves was actually a good thing for me in Pokemon Online. The trick is to switch Gyarados into something that you know can't functionally harm it, preferably something like Heatran or Metagross, and while the opponent switches to something with an electric attack, use dragon dance. You're now faster than anything except Deoxys-S and things with choice scarf, and no one uses choice scarf on electric pokemon because they're usually already damn fast.

If the enemy switches into an electric pokemon, you use earthquake. If they switch into a Zapdos (or Emolga), you use stone edge. If they switch into something else, you use whatever is most appropriate. My Gyarados ran DD/earthquake/stone edge/waterfall. My team had no ice moves, which was admittedly a huge problem, but Gyarados with only one DD could destroy almost anything - very few things can handle all three of those attack types, the most common problem I encountered was multiscale Dragonite.

There are somethings you still don't outspeed after 1 DD I'm pretty sure. Like Starmie. And I always run Taunt set.

And Advance Gyara > all other iterations for me. HP Flying <3.

Starmie does not outspeed DDed Gyarados. I know. It also cannot take a DDed earthquake.

I know that, too.

:)

Which was a good thing, because Starmie destroyed the rest of my team and it was incredibly common.

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@hobo

Well by Advance it was already godawful and it wasn't any good to begin with, but in Gen II I'd rather have Meganium instead of Feraligatr any day.

As for worst starter competitively, that's easily true now. The only competition for that would be Serperior, but Serperior is at least fast and will become a powerhouse once its Dream World ability will be released.

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From: Anagram | #394

yeah it looks like i was mistaken about this =o

From: SuorGenoveffa | #395

@hobo

Well by Advance it was already godawful and it wasn't any good to begin with, but in Gen II I'd rather have Meganium instead of Feraligatr any day.

As for worst starter competitively, that's easily true now. The only competition for that would be Serperior, but Serperior is at least fast and will become a powerhouse once its Dream World ability will be released.

i'd rather pass on playing competitive GSC thanks lol

I'd rather play competitive GSC honestly. I know, Blissey blabla Skarmory blabla, but I'm not a fan of the offensive turn that followed after that.

I guess Advance was still okay, but with Gen IV they went too far IMO.

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i haven't played much DPP to have a solid opinion on it tbqh. It sucks that a few weeks after I thought things had stabilized, BW was announced and I lost all interest for DPP.

SuorGenoveffa posted...

GenesisSaga posted...

Interesting!

Suor buddy, you ranking today? :3

Most likely, yes.

Boo. >=(

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I have reasons, I swear!

I don't think I will be able to post tonight, but I'm pretty sure tomorrow I will.

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Bump

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