Board 8 > All-Purpose Wrestling Topic 448: Money in the Briefcase

(+) Yeah! (+)

I will say its kind of interesting that the whole MitB build started with Oh god Braun qualified, hes gonna win, never wavered from that concept, and ended with him winning.

Its one of the most straightforward stories theyve ever told <_<
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Kofi winning would have been fun and have given New Day some freshness they needed. I dunno. Would have been a nice dynamic and something for them to do.

Braun just seems like he sits around with it for a while because Brock is never around and having a big monster with it kind of defeats the purpose of these cash ins because logically he shouldn't care to sneakily cash it in. Like, why doesn't Braun just come out on Raw and demand Brock come and fight him now? That's the most logical thing for him to do since he thinks he'll beat anyone.

I dunno. It just seems wrong and not very interesting because when is there ever a chance that Braun will be thwarted in his cash in before they ring the bell or any of the gimmicks involved? And we already ditched the female briefcase so this is all we really have left now for a storyline. Feels weak.
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scarletspeed7 posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

TheKnightOfNee posted...

That match did have some really fun moments. I just wanted to see some other people win more.

I had Braun kinda as my least favorite winner. Because he's already the most unstoppable guy on the main roster, why give him the thing that makes it the easiest to win a title?

I had Miz as the worst option because the feud between Daniel Bryan and Miz really should be a personal grudge. I don't want a title kind of obfuscating what makes that story great already. And also Miz doing MitB heel tactics would be so prosaic.

Nah, Miz is perfect to get the title off AJ Styles. To me, there was a really natural progression:

AJ drops to Shin.
Shin drops to Bryan at Summerslam.
Bryan gets cashed in by Miz in a clear reference to Bryan's first WWE title win.
The feud begins.
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Jakyl25 posted...

I will say its kind of interesting that the whole MitB build started with Oh god Braun qualified, hes gonna win, never wavered from that concept, and ended with him winning.

Its one of the most straightforward stories theyve ever told <_<

It's also kind of a swerve, because we've been conditioned to never expect the obvious outcome (at least when Roman isn't involved, and even then he lost his last two Lesnar matches)
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PrivateBiscuit1 posted...

Kofi winning would have been fun and have given New Day some freshness they needed. I dunno. Would have been a nice dynamic and something for them to do.

Braun just seems like he sits around with it for a while because Brock is never around and having a big monster with it kind of defeats the purpose of these cash ins because logically he shouldn't care to sneakily cash it in. Like, why doesn't Braun just come out on Raw and demand Brock come and fight him now? That's the most logical thing for him to do since he thinks he'll beat anyone.

I dunno. It just seems wrong and not very interesting because when is there ever a chance that Braun will be thwarted in his cash in before they ring the bell or any of the gimmicks involved? And we already ditched the female briefcase so this is all we really have left now for a storyline. Feels weak.

Braun says he's cashing in his MitB contract at the beginning of RAW.
Brock doesn't show up.
Braun wins by DQ but doesn't win the title.
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GTM posted...

Strife2 posted...

I've found my cure for insomnia.

doesn't look like that cure worked at all :(

Nope. But hey, at least I have it in mind someday.
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RaidenZeroX posted...

Jakyl25 posted...

I will say its kind of interesting that the whole MitB build started with Oh god Braun qualified, hes gonna win, never wavered from that concept, and ended with him winning.

Its one of the most straightforward stories theyve ever told <_<

It's also kind of a swerve, because we've been conditioned to never expect the obvious outcome (at least when Roman isn't involved, and even then he lost his last two Lesnar matches)

Michael Cole freaking opened the match with I bet my mortgage on Strowman

And then he won!
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TheRock1525 posted...

PrivateBiscuit1 posted...

Kofi winning would have been fun and have given New Day some freshness they needed. I dunno. Would have been a nice dynamic and something for them to do.

Braun just seems like he sits around with it for a while because Brock is never around and having a big monster with it kind of defeats the purpose of these cash ins because logically he shouldn't care to sneakily cash it in. Like, why doesn't Braun just come out on Raw and demand Brock come and fight him now? That's the most logical thing for him to do since he thinks he'll beat anyone.

I dunno. It just seems wrong and not very interesting because when is there ever a chance that Braun will be thwarted in his cash in before they ring the bell or any of the gimmicks involved? And we already ditched the female briefcase so this is all we really have left now for a storyline. Feels weak.

Braun says he's cashing in his MitB contract at the beginning of RAW.
Brock doesn't show up.
Braun wins by DQ but doesn't win the title.

Another successful defense by Brock!
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I just realized. Team Little Big got both briefcases.

Didn't Alexa even mention last week that Braun was going to win?
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Yeah I love Braun, but in the moment my heart belonged to Kofi.
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https://twitter.com/smFISHMAN/status/1008549058984718337
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Brock could probably successfully thwart MitB by just not showing up for a year
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Well, Brock does have that whole defend every 30 days clause out of his contract.
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TheRock1525 posted...

scarletspeed7 posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

TheKnightOfNee posted...

That match did have some really fun moments. I just wanted to see some other people win more.

I had Braun kinda as my least favorite winner. Because he's already the most unstoppable guy on the main roster, why give him the thing that makes it the easiest to win a title?

I had Miz as the worst option because the feud between Daniel Bryan and Miz really should be a personal grudge. I don't want a title kind of obfuscating what makes that story great already. And also Miz doing MitB heel tactics would be so prosaic.

Nah, Miz is perfect to get the title off AJ Styles. To me, there was a really natural progression:

AJ drops to Shin.
Shin drops to Bryan at Summerslam.
Bryan gets cashed in by Miz in a clear reference to Bryan's first WWE title win.
The feud begins.

That doesn't feel that real to me, and in all honesty, Bryan is the only guy who makes anything feel real, so if the Miz, who is a super-WWE guy, can be part of a non-WWE feud, it's a great opportunity. Miz has demonstrated that he is such a talent when he goes off the generic scripts that a Miz/Bryan feud - WITHOUT TITLES - means less of a dictatorial hand in the writing. And I think that both men would thrive with a little leeway together.
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RaidenZeroX posted...

https://twitter.com/smFISHMAN/status/1008549058984718337

Love it.

And yeah I would normally agree with Biscuit except....feh. MitB chicken shit is sort of played out and sitting it on the bench for a year is fine.

Plus I think that arguably Braun NEEDS the briefcase in kayfabe if he wants another crack at Brock since this will be his 4th chance at the guy
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Yeah thats right, Nakamura is at 6 PPV Title shots without a title, but Braun isnt far behind at 4.
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Got it

Braun should take Lesnar out beyond recovery, then give MitB to Nicholas
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Much less glaring with Braun since he's only had one 1v1 title shot so far.
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scarletspeed7 posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

scarletspeed7 posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

TheKnightOfNee posted...

That match did have some really fun moments. I just wanted to see some other people win more.

I had Braun kinda as my least favorite winner. Because he's already the most unstoppable guy on the main roster, why give him the thing that makes it the easiest to win a title?

I had Miz as the worst option because the feud between Daniel Bryan and Miz really should be a personal grudge. I don't want a title kind of obfuscating what makes that story great already. And also Miz doing MitB heel tactics would be so prosaic.

Nah, Miz is perfect to get the title off AJ Styles. To me, there was a really natural progression:

AJ drops to Shin.
Shin drops to Bryan at Summerslam.
Bryan gets cashed in by Miz in a clear reference to Bryan's first WWE title win.
The feud begins.

That doesn't feel that real to me, and in all honesty, Bryan is the only guy who makes anything feel real, so if the Miz, who is a super-WWE guy, can be part of a non-WWE feud, it's a great opportunity. Miz has demonstrated that he is such a talent when he goes off the generic scripts that a Miz/Bryan feud - WITHOUT TITLES - means less of a dictatorial hand in the writing. And I think that both men would thrive with a little leeway together.

Nah, to me it's a lot better than a simple grudge match. For one thing, you have to remember that Bryan never lost his WWE title. He was stripped of it by the Authority, and that has to eat away at him more than simply getting beat for it. So him finally getting a one-on-one title shot and getting back the title he never lost would be a huge, emotional win for him after having to leave the ring for two years due to injury.

Now imagine Miz crapping on it by cashing in, taking that moment from Bryan. And imagine the promos afterwards where Bryan can all out that Miz is a two-time WWE champion, but he was forced to use a MitB briefcase both times. That when Bryan made those original comments that Miz wrestled a cowardly style and Miz flipped out, Bryan was absolutely 100% right about him.

To me, that's infinitely better than "Braun Strowman now has the easiest route to a championship even though he beats everyone up and always wins anyway."
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MITB was miles better than Backlash, even if it had some stupid booking decisions.

- Bryan beating Big Cass again leads him to AJ/Nakamura/Joe, so that's good
- Lashley hopefully put the death feud TO death for good
- Rollins/Elias was good, though the finish was awkward
- Why does Alexa need MITB?
- Why does Alexa need the title again?
- Chicago decided against cheering for Jinder and instead fell asleep.
- Why was Asuka struck dumb by Ellsworth of all people?
- AJ/Nakamura was amazing and finally got the match they should have...but Nakamura lost
- Ronda is ridiculously good already. She carried Nia to a match people cared about and kept caring about.
- But again, why does Alexa need the title again?
- I wanted Kofi to win. I really wanted him to win.
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I'm one of the biggest Alexa fans in this topic, and I can't explain why she needs the title again, or the briefcase. If Raw won the mens, they should have just given it to Becky. She really deserves a real shot, but then there would be two briefcases that wouldn't have the random cash-in threat since she'd probably also challenge ahead of time (and then lose, because she can't ever get a proper run)
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Also this is now 3 PPVs where Braun stands tall at the end, which might be a record for someone with 0 World Titles
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https://twitter.com/KeepItFiveStar/status/1008548823201992705
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Alexa won because they must have at least one of the MitB winners be a scummy heel

That's seriously my best estimation
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Lopen posted...

Alexa won because they must have at least one of the MitB winners be a scummy heel

That's seriously my best estimation

Certainly makes sense. I was really hoping that she wouldn't be able to reach the briefcase and would throw a tantrum on top of the ladder.
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Like I know I'm in the minority here, but Braun is slowly sucking the life out of the product for me. I don't want an invincible, unbeatable guy who's not even an average wrestler as the top guy. I liked him when he was just doing out of the ring shenanigans and finding new excuses to beat up Roman Reigns.

It's amazing how NXT puts out their monster in a title match, he loses, and I care much more about him going forward than Braun. And I still buy Lars as a legit monster because he no-sold the Black Mass and had to eat a second one immediately to get put down.
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Braun has so irrelevant for the past few months. I feel like you're just trying to pin general disinterest in the product on a scapegoat.
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Lopen posted...

Alexa won because they must have at least one of the MitB winners be a scummy heel

That's seriously my best estimation

The obvious route was Ronda Rousey's best friend cashing-in on her if they wanted scummy heel.

Or if they had bothered to go through with Sasha's desperately needed heel turn.
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TheRock1525 posted...

Nah, to me it's a lot better than a simple grudge match. For one thing, you have to remember that Bryan never lost his WWE title. He was stripped of it by the Authority, and that has to eat away at him more than simply getting beat for it. So him finally getting a one-on-one title shot and getting back the title he never lost would be a huge, emotional win for him after having to leave the ring for two years due to injury.

Now imagine Miz crapping on it by cashing in, taking that moment from Bryan. And imagine the promos afterwards where Bryan can all out that Miz is a two-time WWE champion, but he was forced to use a MitB briefcase both times. That when Bryan made those original comments that Miz wrestled a cowardly style and Miz flipped out, Bryan was absolutely 100% right about him.

To me, that's infinitely better than "Braun Strowman now has the easiest route to a championship even though he beats everyone up and always wins anyway."

So instead of two separate memorable storylines for Bryan that could draw, you want one?
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I know Sam Roberts (the goof podcaster with the afro) claims Vince is slowly, VERY slowly transitioning to Braun over Roman, so maybe the long con may be right. Roberts may be right, but we have to remember this.'

Transitioning from Luger to Bret: 6-9 months
Transitioning from Roman to...anyone else: 3-5 years

I know "VINCE MCMAHON LIKES BIG SWEATY MEN," but I don't know if even he can be convinced out of his love affair with Roman. I'm just shocked someone convinced him not to put Roman/Jinder on last this month.
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Lopen posted...

Braun has so irrelevant for the past few months. I feel like you're just trying to pin general disinterest in the product on a scapegoat.

Considering they've been building MitB for a while now, he's definitely not been irrelevant for the past month.
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I feel that way about Roman. I could watch Braun shoulder tackle people all day, and I find him really entertaining. I do wish they'd go back to him destroying people like they did when he was a heel, but that's why he became a face in the first place, people got too into the destruction.

Fun fact: I think this was the second match in Braun's career when he didn't miss a shoulder tackle into the ringpost.
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scarletspeed7 posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

Nah, to me it's a lot better than a simple grudge match. For one thing, you have to remember that Bryan never lost his WWE title. He was stripped of it by the Authority, and that has to eat away at him more than simply getting beat for it. So him finally getting a one-on-one title shot and getting back the title he never lost would be a huge, emotional win for him after having to leave the ring for two years due to injury.

Now imagine Miz crapping on it by cashing in, taking that moment from Bryan. And imagine the promos afterwards where Bryan can all out that Miz is a two-time WWE champion, but he was forced to use a MitB briefcase both times. That when Bryan made those original comments that Miz wrestled a cowardly style and Miz flipped out, Bryan was absolutely 100% right about him.

To me, that's infinitely better than "Braun Strowman now has the easiest route to a championship even though he beats everyone up and always wins anyway."

So instead of two separate memorable storylines for Bryan that could draw, you want one?

I want one really well done one than one OK one followed by a second OK one, yes.
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TheRock1525 posted...

I want one really well done one than one OK one followed by a second OK one, yes.

You don't need more stakes to make a better storyline. You need better writing. Spread out the story, allow the star to matter longer. It's not even dragging it out. It's providing a story with emotional stakes in one feud before moving on to a different story with a different type of emotional stakes later on.
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I felt like the build was more to the MitB match than Braun himself.

I mean it was basically the same cliche "let's have everyone in the match fight each other and cut chain promos" etc with Braun being one of the 4 Raw guys who had one.

Like I dunno I just don't see why Braun would "kill interest in the product" when to me he just feels like another guy on the product.
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scarletspeed7 posted...

You don't need more stakes to make a better storyline. You need better writing. Spread out the story, allow the star to matter longer. It's not even dragging it out. It's providing a story with emotional stakes in one feud before moving on to a different story with a different type of emotional stakes later on.

Right, but we've touched on a lot the emotional parts of their rivalry, they just never got physical over it. Adding the physicality while revisiting stuff we've already done is fine, but uninspiring.

Creating a whole new point of contention, one that cuts deep both ways, creates a much better storyline.
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I think what kills interest in the product is that there is this immediate momentum in a lot of moments that is never seized upon. It should have been obvious that Kofi being chosen would inspire people to think, "Wow, wouldn't it be crazy if Kofi won?"

But instead we get safe choices in both cases (no pun intended). The idea of "anything can happen" really doesn't exist except in head-scratching booking choices. Like, they create these immediate moments of, "Could something THAT crazy really occur?" but they don't seize on it and it kind of deflates most other options afterwards.
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Jakyl25 posted...

Also this is now 3 PPVs where Braun stands tall at the end, which might be a record for someone with 0 World Titles

Just wanted to say I think I found the overall winner here

Roddy Piper won the main event of 1 WWE PPV and 4 WCW PPVs
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Lopen posted...

Like I dunno I just don't see why Braun would "kill interest in the product" when to me he just feels like another guy on the product.

It's pretty straight forward.

I don't like invincible characters who win all the time, who dominate matches and are rarely allowed to look weak as the top babyface. It makes matches feel completely pointless. Braun will dominate, opponent gets a few ineffective shots in, Braun makes a "comeback" (if you can call it that) and wins. He's basically treating the main eventers of the product the way he treated Mark Henry during the early days of his singles push. And they did that to make him a massive monster heel for someone to overcome (coughromancough) but now that he's a babyface, it just doesn't work for me.
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Lopen posted...

I felt like the build was more to the MitB match than Braun himself.

I mean it was basically the same cliche "let's have everyone in the match fight each other and cut chain promos" etc with Braun being one of the 4 Raw guys who had one.

Like I dunno I just don't see why Braun would "kill interest in the product" when to me he just feels like another guy on the product.

I mean he's been main eventing pretty much every show during the MitB build up and has pretty consistently had him stomping everyone with the only things that slow him down briefly are his own momentum being used against him and eating continuous two or three on one beatings with ample big moves thrown in, which can make him dazed for a few minutes.

Braun being invincible isn't exactly a minor part of Raw
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Panthera posted...

Lopen posted...

I felt like the build was more to the MitB match than Braun himself.

I mean it was basically the same cliche "let's have everyone in the match fight each other and cut chain promos" etc with Braun being one of the 4 Raw guys who had one.

Like I dunno I just don't see why Braun would "kill interest in the product" when to me he just feels like another guy on the product.

I mean he's been main eventing pretty much every show during the MitB build up and has pretty consistently had him stomping everyone with the only things that slow him down briefly are his own momentum being used against him and eating continuous two or three on one beatings with ample big moves thrown in, which can make him dazed for a few minutes.

Braun being invincible isn't exactly a minor part of Raw

Yup, this is the type of the booking that makes you think "Oh man, they're really building up this guy so when the top babyface finally takes him down, it's gonna be huge."

Except he IS the babyface.
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I don't see how it matters that much though.

Like his show relevance to me has felt more on par with The Undefeated Tatanka lately. I mean yeah he wins a lot but he's just a guy. He's not hijacking the entire show's focus or anything. I'd understand it a lot more if he actually was clearly the top guy.
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TheRock1525 posted...

scarletspeed7 posted...

You don't need more stakes to make a better storyline. You need better writing. Spread out the story, allow the star to matter longer. It's not even dragging it out. It's providing a story with emotional stakes in one feud before moving on to a different story with a different type of emotional stakes later on.

Right, but we've touched on a lot the emotional parts of their rivalry, they just never got physical over it. Adding the physicality while revisiting stuff we've already done is fine, but uninspiring.

Creating a whole new point of contention, one that cuts deep both ways, creates a much better storyline.

But it doesn't. Miz doesn't have to have the title for that to work. That becomes TOO neat and TOO staged, and TOO WWE. When you look at great old feuds, it's more about being raw and organic. When you choreograph everything to such a point that you're recreating another moment just to pile onto an already solid feud, you're hurting business later.

It's also not uninspiring. The Miz's promos cut against Bryan have never been addressed. Why add more wrinkles now, before you need to? Hell, you could even do the Miz-Bryan feud, have Bryan start going for the title proper later on and re-insert Miz again, this time desperately trying to prove Bryan wrong through whatever takes he can. You can evolve BOTH characters with longer term storytelling. If you just want Miz to be a static character, then yes, go the way you're describing. But static characters are what kills WWE.
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Its just the Goldberg character.

People still liked goldberg
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It pretty much is exactly Goldberg, right down to his lack of being focused on on the show.
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Eddv posted...

Its just the Goldberg character.

People still liked goldberg

The Goldberg character also lost its luster after it was forced into matches that weren't completely designed to suit its bailiwick. His recent return pretty much proved that the character was a phenomenon of a certain kind and required certain positioning.

Braun is very similar, and what has hurt him recently is making him a family-friendly babyface. Nicholas really is a sign of "we don't get it" in the writers' room.
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scarletspeed7 posted...

But it doesn't.

It does to me, by a huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge margin. Bryan and Miz have made plenty of verbal sparring that if all you're gonna give me is "and now they fight" I'm not gonna care as much. Because that's all you're basically doing, take a feud from 2016 and finally giving it matches. Alright. There's nothing much to explore more on a personal level between those two, they've already said what they're gonna say and the promos themselves won't do much leading up to the match. Like not unless you have Miz go a more blood-feud route and try to end Bryan's career again or something.
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TheRock1525 posted...

I don't like invincible characters who win all the time, who dominate matches and are rarely allowed to look weak as the top babyface.

You sure picked the wrong company then
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Jakyl25 posted...

TheRock1525 posted...

I don't like invincible characters who win all the time, who dominate matches and are rarely allowed to look weak as the top babyface.

You sure picked the wrong company then

Not really. Most "invincible" babyfaces are at least asked to sell and seem like they're in trouble before they overcome their odds. What is Braun overcoming? Nothing. He's the biggest, strongest guy who never loses and always dominates his matches.
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Braun might be unbeatable and all that, but Raw is still built around Roman right now. They work in so many references to him in unrelated segments.
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