Poll of the Day > Who wins in a fight: adult Link (OoT), or Cloud (FFVII)?

(+) Yeah! (+)

All weapons, items, materia, magic, etc.

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Depends greatly on the rules of the fight. I'd put the completed Triforce on par in power with the Lifestream... so any Mako SOLDIER should be as strong as any 1Triforce Hero (not to scale)

Link can have 4 pots with fairies to survive Omnislash a few times so might be able to out-tank Cloud, but Cloud could have glitchy-ass All-Materia combos that are hella broken resulting in infinite-damage and the game would crash 'cuz Link ha farieis.

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Cloud with or without magic and shit, he's a professional soldier, Link is some just orphan who is brave lulz, what a wiener kid.

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Link could use magic armor to survive for a while, but after that, those 4 jarred fairies won't likely outlast HP:0-Phoenix, especially if Cloud's packing elixirs.

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Shadowbird_RH posted...

especially if Cloud's packing elixirs.

One of the reasons I had to ask for rules, since with W-Item you can just dupe items IN BATTLE

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OoT Link would be my vote. Weaker offence than Cloud probably but Nayru's Love is outright invincibility.

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darcandkharg31 posted...

Link is just some orphan who is brave

Not to mention he does not have formal experience in sword-play to my recollection.
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darcandkharg31 posted...

Cloud with or without magic and shit, he's a professional soldier, Link is some just orphan who is brave lulz, what a wiener kid.

lol, this

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Pre-emptive strike materia
W-summon Knights of the Round (Table)
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Goku
He stopped a sword with just his finger.

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darcandkharg31 posted...

Cloud with or without magic and shit, he's a professional soldier, Link is some just orphan who is brave lulz, what a wiener kid.

Cloud wasn't really a SOLDIER.
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lihlih posted...

Cloud wasn't really a SOLDIER.

He was a trained Shinra soldier bud, he just wasn't SOLDIER.
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Death battle covered this and link won. Though i disagree with the results because one of the reasons link won was because they said his shield was unbreakable which I dont think ia official lore, more that theyve just never had shields breaking as a game mechanic till botw.

I think the auto revive fairies is what truly one him thr battle in their minds though since he can carry 4 of them in OoT (which i believe was the version of link they used)

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Kyuubi4269 posted...

He was a trained Shinra soldier bud, he just wasn't SOLDIER.

He was a grunt that used a gun. And not a very good one i assume. Nothing crisis core showed implied he was any good anyways. He didnt become a great fighter till after his mako infusion. Only feat he had before then was one of those power of love/friendship bs moments where he prevailed just because of how mad he was over a friend being hurt.

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mooreandrew58 posted...

He was a grunt that used a gun. And not a very good one i assume. Nothing crisis core showed implied he was any good anyways. He didnt become a great fighter till after his mako infusion. Only feat he had before then was one of those power of love/friendship bs moments where he prevailed just because of how mad he was over a friend being hurt.

That was more of Sephiroth being weakened incredibly by Zack before Cloud came in. Cloud was basically the straw that broke the camel's back.
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lihlih posted...

That was more of Sephiroth being weakened incredibly by Zack before Cloud came in. Cloud was basically the straw that broke the camel's back.

He still survived and fought through being impaled. Something that would end most people

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mooreandrew58 posted...

He was a grunt that used a gun.

So a trained Shinra solider.

mooreandrew58 posted...

And not a very good one i assume.

Based on what? He accompanied 1st class and a 2nd class SOLDIER on multiple SOLDIER excursions. He didn't sit around Shinra HQ or handle other mook work. He was physically fit with military experience and witnessed first hand world class soldiers in combat, he wasn't a random kid from Kokiri Forest.

After being drugged with ridiculous amounts of concentrated crack he took on the fighting style he personally witnessed and could perform thanks to his crack addiction. He was a competent soldier that had pretty serious enhancements, even during bombing mission he was pretty OP.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

So a trained Shinra solider.

Based on what? He accompanied 1st class and a 2nd class SOLDIER on multiple SOLDIER excursions. He didn't sit around Shinra HQ or handle other mook work. He was physically fit with military experience and witnessed first hand world class soldiers in combat, he wasn't a random kid from Kokiri Forest.

After being drugged with ridiculous amounts of concentrated crack he took on the fighting style he personally witnessed and could perform thanks to his crack addiction. He was a competent soldier that had pretty serious enhancements, even during bombing mission he was pretty OP.

He did nothing noteworthy. Its been awhile since i played crisis core but i recall nothing that implied he was steong in anyway.

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mooreandrew58 posted...

He did nothing noteworthy. Its been awhile since i played crisis core but i recall nothing that implied he was steong in anyway.

It's like it wasn't his story and everywhere he goes it's in an assisting role.
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

It's like it wasn't his story and everywhere he goes it's in an assisting role.

I think his personality makes me assume he sucked. He seemed like he didnt even think much of himself.

Not like assisting roles in stories never get a noteworthy moment in fights.

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mooreandrew58 posted...

I think his personality makes me assume he sucked. He seemed like he didnt even think much of himself.

Not like assisting roles in stories never get a noteworthy moment in fights.

He's literally an anime protagonist; no matter how OP he is, he'll be unconfident and aspire to an honourable goal.

He finished off sephiroth by pure force of will, that's his "noteworthy moment".
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

He's literally an anime protagonist; no matter how OP he is, he'll be unconfident and aspire to an honourable goal.

He finished off sephiroth by pure force of will, that's his "noteworthy moment".

As said that was one of those ba power of friendship momenta to me.

Anyways more on the topic at hand I'll add if we are talking how cloud was originally portrayed or advent children cloud. AC cloud would stomp link. But I dont think that level of OP was the original intention. Original version i can see link winning as he has the tools to survive anything cloud throws at him at least for a bried time then tools to auto revive multiple times

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mooreandrew58 posted...

to me.

ok

mooreandrew58 posted...

Anyways more on the topic at hand I'll add if we are talking how cloud was originally portrayed or advent children cloud. AC cloud would stomp link. But I dont think that level of OP was the original intention. Original version i can see link winning as he has the tools to survive anything cloud throws at him at least for a bried time then tools to auto revive multiple times

Cloud casts Reflect.

What's Link going to do? Throw boomerangs? Fight a skilled and drugged up swordsman one-on-one? As mentioned before final attack + pheonix means Cloud can infinitely revive, he just needs to keep mp up.
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mooreandrew58 posted...

Death battle covered this and link won.

I remember this one. I dont think I really liked the reasoning that gave, though. But its been a long time since Ive seen it. Also, I watched something once that went over which Link was the strongest. IIRC, it was NOT OoT Link...
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Kyuubi4269 posted...

What's Link going to do? Throw boomerangs?

As an adult he wouldnt have boomerangs. He would have Naurus Love still...
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LinkPizza posted...

I remember this one. I dont think I really liked the reasoning that gave, though. But its been a long time since Ive seen it. Also, I watched something once that went over which Link was the strongest. IIRC, it was NOT OoT Link...

Botw link seems physically stronger based on the bowling minigame. That giant snowball must be heavy yet he can lift and throw it. In OoT he needs items to enhance his strength to lift heavy objects. But in battles like this one must consider equipment so link even OoT is no slouch in the strength department. (heck as far as i know being able to lift those giant pillars with the gold gauntlets is thr biggest feat strength wise any link has pulled off. But i havent played all games)

As far as the death battle video the unbreakable shield thing was thr only logic they used I found faulty as i said i think thats more of a gameplay thing than actual lore.

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Kyuubi4269 posted...

ok

Cloud casts Reflect.

What's Link going to do? Throw boomerangs? Fight a skilled and drugged up swordsman one-on-one? As mentioned before final attack + pheonix means Cloud can infinitely revive, he just needs to keep mp up.

I dont recall the final attack plus phoenix being able to be infinitely used in battle. Am i rembering wrong?

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mooreandrew58 posted...

I dont recall the final attack plus phoenix being able to be infinitely used in battle. Am i rembering wrong?

It can be used 5 times when mastered, also:

If the character has two copies of the same Magic or Summon Materia paired with Quadra Magic and Final Attack, the party member will use the spell four times when killed. This applies to Master Materia as well. For example, if a player character is killed with Master Summon paired with Quadra Magic and Phoenix paired with Final Attack, they will cast Phoenix Flame four times when killed.

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mooreandrew58 posted...

Botw link seems physically stronger based on the bowling minigame. That giant snowball must be heavy yet he can lift and throw it. In OoT he needs items to enhance his strength to lift heavy objects. But in battles like this one must consider equipment so link even OoT is no slouch in the strength department. (heck as far as i know being able to lift those giant pillars with the gold gauntlets is thr biggest feat strength wise any link has pulled off. But i havent played all games)

As far as the death battle video the unbreakable shield thing was thr only logic they used I found faulty as i said i think thats more of a gameplay thing than actual lore.

I don't remember where BotW Link was. But the guy who did it based it off of Link, rather than the game. As they were some Links who were in multiple game. So, he based it on their whole Arsenal. The hero of Time was second. Partly because of Fierce Deity Mask, IIRC...

The Hero of Legend from "A Link to the past", "Oracle of Seasons", "Oracle of Ages", and "Link's Awakening" was the Strongest.

Here's the video. Some may not agree. I like it, though...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kM4IB7swnA
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mooreandrew58 posted...

Anyways more on the topic at hand I'll add if we are talking how cloud was originally portrayed or advent children cloud. AC cloud would stomp link. But I dont think that level of OP was the original intention.

Original Cloud was pretty beastly. He was able to fire meteors out of his sword without using Materia.

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Metalsonic66 posted...

Original Cloud was pretty beastly. He was able to fire meteors out of his sword without using Materia.

And make a tornado by swinging his sword that would send sandworms in to orbit.
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That too!

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mooreandrew58 posted...

Botw link seems physically stronger based on the bowling minigame. That giant snowball must be heavy yet he can lift and throw it. In OoT he needs items to enhance his strength to lift heavy objects. But in battles like this one must consider equipment so link even OoT is no slouch in the strength department. (heck as far as i know being able to lift those giant pillars with the gold gauntlets is thr biggest feat strength wise any link has pulled off. But i havent played all games)

As far as the death battle video the unbreakable shield thing was thr only logic they used I found faulty as i said i think thats more of a gameplay thing than actual lore.

In Advent Children, he cuts up huge chunks of buildings effortlessly. That's a way bigger feat if strength than Link lifting shit up(while struggling IIRC).
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lihlih posted...

Link lifting shit up(while struggling IIRC).

I don't think he really struggled that much. He didn't pull it out of the ground very fast. But he did toss it pretty easily once out of the ground...
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Any Fire Emblem protagonist would wreck these two easily.

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lihlih posted...

In Advent Children, he cuts up huge chunks of buildings effortlessly. That's a way bigger feat if strength than Link lifting shit up(while struggling IIRC).

Why I said it depends on if its AC cloud or original cloud.

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lihlih posted...

he cuts up huge chunks of buildings effortlessly

You mean like Sora.
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mooreandrew58 posted...

As far as the death battle video the unbreakable shield thing was thr only logic they used I found faulty as i said i think thats more of a gameplay thing than actual lore.

In Skyward Sword the Hylian Shield is a special shield bestowed as a gift by a dragon and is said to be blessed by the goddess to be unbreakable.

So there is an indestructible shield in Zelda lore.

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T0ffee posted...

In Skyward Sword the Hylian Shield is a special shield bestowed as a gift by a dragon and is said to be blessed by the goddess to be unbreakable.

So there is an indestructible shield in Zelda lore.

Also, while it breaks in BotW, it technically never breaks in OoT...
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T0ffee posted...

In Skyward Sword the Hylian Shield is a special shield bestowed as a gift by a dragon and is said to be blessed by the goddess to be unbreakable.

So there is an indestructible shield in Zelda lore.

Ok. That didnt exist iirc when the video came out but thanks for letting me know that. That and wind waker are tge two console games ive missed

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TheFalseDeity posted...

OoT Link would be my vote. Weaker offence than Cloud probably but Nayru's Love is outright invincibility.

Knights of the round ignores defense, and can't miss the target. Even if Nayru's love did block it, it only lasts for 1 minute, a single cast of knights of the round is longer than that, and with proper junctioning you can set up multicast, Cloud can also have more auto revives set up than Link, and Clouds will do damage to Link as he is revived.
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LinkPizza posted...

Also, while it breaks in BotW, it technically never breaks in OoT...

Technically the OoT Hylian Shield isn't THE Hylian Shield in that game since it can still be eaten by Like Likes.

The indestructible shield in OoT would be the Mirror Shield.

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Link moves faster and has a fucking invincibility spell.

This is the one time Death Battle DID get it right.
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T0ffee posted...

Technically the OoT Hylian Shield isn't THE Hylian Shield in that game since it can still be eaten by Like Likes.

The indestructible shield in OoT would be the Mirror Shield.

It can be eaten by like likes, but you can get it out of them. The only reason the mirror shield can't be taken away is because you need it to be the game. Where you should be able to beat the game without the Hylian shield. But even when eaten, it isn't destroyed...
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Endgame posted...

This is the one time Death Battle DID get it right.

I do think Link could beat Cloud. But I also remember not really agreeing with the reasoning. That was the only thing. I might watch again to see why I didn't agree, though...
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LinkPizza posted...

It can be eaten by like likes, but you can get it out of them. The only reason the mirror shield can't be taken away is because you need it to be the game. Where you should be able to beat the game without the Hylian shield. But even when eaten, it isn't destroyed...

Beating OoT aside from required mirror shield sections is actually fun. Think you may have to use the kokri shield for deku tree too. But outside that a shieldless run is fun as hell. Makes you use side jumps and backflips to dodge

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While it would be hard to say given their very different depictions of damage, it's worth remembering is Link is a chosen one and wins simply by virtue of plot device.


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Zeus posted...

While it would be hard to say given their very different depictions of damage, it's worth remembering is Link is a chosen one and wins simply by virtue of plot device.

IIRC, The Hero of Winds wasn't chosen exactly. He just found the triforce to basically make them choose him or something... He just wanted to get his sister back...
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Lokarin posted...

Depends greatly on the rules of the fight.

While these battle questions are always ridiculous, this is the most important question. Because with the Trifoce and Ocarina allowed, Link is basically a God that can also time travel, meaning he would win the fight before it even began. And that's just the OoT version -in MM, he actually can become a God.

But yeah, Link wins this. He has an insane amount of durability and tricks, with a varied arsenal and a good amount of offense, and that's even before you get into his god-like abilities. And hell, if glitches are allowed, there's a very easy to-do glitch in OoT that allows you to get 24 fairy bottles. But I'll assume that can be left out. Essentially, Link can just win a war of attrition against Cloud, if nothing else.

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CyborgSage00x0 posted...

While these battle questions are always ridiculous, this is the most important question. Because with the Trifoce and Ocarina allowed, Link is basically a God that can also time travel, meaning he would win the fight before it even began. And that's just the OoT version -in MM, he actually can become a God.

But yeah, Link wins this. He has an insane amount of durability and tricks, with a varied arsenal and a good amount of offense, and that's even before you get into his god-like abilities. And hell, if glitches are allowed, there's a very easy to-do glitch in OoT that allows you to get 24 fairy bottles. But I'll assume that can be left out. Essentially, Link can just win a war of attrition against Cloud, if nothing else.

It doesnt apply here but i hate fight debates that dont take personality and or character flaws into account. The mention of rules made me think that. Like the reason batman can beat superman is because superman isnt willing to go all out against even villains let alone batman.

Its also why i think genesis could have beat sepiroth had angeal not interfered. Sepiroth was holding back greatly till that point and it almost cost him.

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