Current Events > Ohio police fatally shoot pregnant woman (Part 2)

(+) Yeah! (+)

So they released the body cam footage:
https://www.cnn.com/2023/09/01/us/takiya-young-ohio-police-shooting/index.html?fbclid=IwAR2uhm2A4Ic8SGLv49m5vOdjYDngdlqX5DBgvEixrYRwanZlUg2XkN4iXk

So I'm gonna call bs! First of all, they cut the footage of her supposedly trying to hit him and go straight to after he shoots. She wasn't moving with enough speed to actually hurt him and he had plenty of time to get out of the way. If he was in front of her, had she been trying to gun it at him, he'd have been run over.

Cop needs to be charged with murder. 2 charges. 1 for the baby

The "she was driving towards the officer" statement is clearly such an extreme misrepresentation of the situation that it should only be called a lie.

Looks like the cop deliberately stood in front of the vehicle in an attempt to block the car with his body in case she fled. Then when she did try to flee he immediately realized he was in the middle of a dangerous situation and shot the pregnant woman to stop himself from getting ran over.

If the cop didn't deliberately place himself in harm's way and instead merely stood off to the side, then maybe the woman, her baby, and also the cop would all still be alive and we'd have a different story to talk about.

How come the pro-lifers are silent about this?

A_Good_Boy posted...

Looks like the cop deliberately stood in front of the vehicle in an attempt to block the car with his body in case she fled. Then when she did try to flee he immediately realized he was in the middle of a dangerous situation and shot the pregnant woman to stop himself from getting ran over.

If the cop didn't deliberately place himself in harm's way and instead merely stood off to the side, then maybe the woman, her baby, and also the cop would all still be alive and we'd have a different story to talk about.

Or, she could have gotten out of her car and surrendered knowing she had no escape.

Tora_Sami posted...

Or, she could have gotten out of her car and surrendered knowing she had no escape.

It's very natural to conclude that an encounter with the police will end with your death when we have so many stories like this. Wanting to not be around the police when they are hostile and high-intensity is a natural result of not wanting to die. Cops like this just justify the fear.

There's absolutely no reason they couldn't have just let her go and then track her down later if they actually thought she was guilty of a crime, all you're doing is trying to justify a police state that allows for Judge Dredds to provide on the spot executions based off shit nobody would ever be sentenced to death over in a court of law.

Kradek posted...

It's very natural to conclude that an encounter with the police will end with your death when we have so many stories like this. Wanting to not be around the police when they are hostile and high-intensity is a natural result of not wanting to die. Cops like this just justify the fear.

There's absolutely no reason they couldn't have just let her go and then track her down later if they actually thought she was guilty of a crime, all you're doing is trying to justify a police state that allows for Judge Dredds to provide on the spot executions based off shit nobody would ever be sentenced to death over in a court of law.

True, police so awful things. But if they have you surrounded you surrender, especially if you know how violent they can be. Trying to flee into a police officer isn't the answer either. While complying won't guarantee you won't die, it's a higher chance then trying to run one down.

Tora_Sami posted...

True, police so awful things. But if they have you surrounded you surrender, especially if you know how violent they can be. Trying to flee into a police officer isn't the answer either. While complying won't guarantee you won't die, it's a higher chance then trying to run one down.

She didn't do the smart thing, I'll agree, I just think it's very natural to want to flee from the presence of the police even if you're innocent and just want to escape their unwarranted harassment. So I understand why her subconscious likely chose flight while she was mentally debating on what to do.

But like I said, that officer still could have gotten out of the way. They always have 2 options, shoot the driver (likely) to death or move out of their way. One allows the civilian to live, the other almost guarantees they don't. I'll always vouch for the one that allows the civilian to live and put the burden of responsibility on the people with the literal authority to enforce the law and be above it for things such as traffic violations. They should be held to higher standards, not lower, due to this privilege they have. Unless of course someone is actively trying to kill the officer and the officer absolutely has to shoot to live. Such a situation is a shoot out with a suspect. Obviously I don't expect the officer to just let themselves be killed, but before someone tries to justify that situation for this case that's why I pointed out he chose to stand in front of her vehicle and not move, whereas someone actively shooting at you is not giving you such an easy resolution for your safety.

Tora_Sami posted...

Or, she could have gotten out of her car and surrendered knowing she had no escape.

She absolutely should have just surrendered. Regardless of that fact though, it's incredibly dangerous to stand in front of a vehicle, point a gun at someone, and create a dilemma where either you or the driver is going to die.

That officer created a dangerous scenario for absolutely no reason, and you can tell right from the video itself that scenario was completely unnecessary because there was another officer there that managed to avoid standing directly in front of the vehicle and didn't needlessly create a false dilemma with anyone's life on the line.

I wonder if the cop even feels guilty he killed a baby. I bet he's "pro life" conservative too. Most cops are Republicans

lolife67 posted...

So I'm gonna call bs! First of all, they cut the footage of her supposedly trying to hit him and go straight to after he shoots. over.

You mean those "necessary redactions" that only the police could do before releasing the video, somehow bolstered the story the police were already telling?

Le shock! Le gasp!

not again!

This part pissed me off the most in this article.

Police say the officers havent waived their rights as victims in this incident and are withholding their identities.

When Ms. Young drove her car directly at Officer #1, striking him, Officer #1 became a victim of attempted vehicular assault, police said in a news release.

When Ms. Young pulled away from Officer #2 while his hand and part of his arm was still in the drivers side window, Officer #2 became a victim of misdemeanor assault, according to the police.

This is just beyond the pale. If I do something at work that endangers me or my coworkers, and someone gets hurt, I get blamed and fired.

These guys are suddenly victims of their own fuckery? Above and beyond assuming the burden of injury on the job. Sure, get workman's comp for being hurt. Cool. But you killed someone. Your name doesn't get hidden from public scrutiny.

A_Good_Boy posted...

Looks like the cop deliberately stood in front of the vehicle in an attempt to block the car with his body in case she fled. Then when she did try to flee he immediately realized he was in the middle of a dangerous situation and shot the pregnant woman to stop himself from getting ran over.

It doesn't look like that at all, except according the the falsified, dishonest telling by the police. Which is inaccurate because these particular officers, as well as any in their department that know the truth and are defending them, are evil pieces of shit.

When do we not hold the other party accountable? What is so hard not getting out of thr car?

omniryu posted...

When do we not hold the other party accountable? What is so hard not getting out of thr car?

What are you talking about? Everyone said she should have gotten out but that doesn't make the cops actions correct. He's the trained professional here and he needlessly escalated the situation when it's his job to do the opposite.

omniryu posted...

When do we not hold the other party accountable? What is so hard not getting out of thr car?

If the cops had done their jobs properly, she would be held accountable for resisting arrest and whatever else she was going to get charged with after arresting her.

The cops should be held accountable for standing in front of her car, creating a dangerous situation where they "had to" shoot her.

lolife67 posted...

What are you talking about? Everyone said she should have gotten out but that doesn't make the cops actions correct. He's the trained professional here and he needlessly escalated the situation when it's his job to do the opposite.

She made that choice to press down on the accelerator. He basically gave her a signal to stay.

yeah there's no way that guy's life was in danger.

there must be more footage before this from the other cop right? because they don't even tell her what she's being accused of in this video

Gwynevere posted...

The cops should be held accountable for standing in front of her car, creating a dangerous situation where they "had to" shoot her.

And in this situation it takes two. He didn't made her press the pedal.

omniryu posted...

And in this situation it takes two. He didn't made her press the pedal.

Did she make him stand in front of the car? If she did force him to stand in front of the car then why didn't the other cop stand in front of the car too?

Based on the video, these cops are not going to get charged with anything for this.

Was her driving off towards the cop in front technically assaulting the cop? Yes.

Was shooting her point blank with a gun through the windshield an even remotely justifiable action from a legal standpoint? From my understanding, yes this cop was probably legally empowered to do what he did to stop her.

Was that the right call for the cop in this situation to shoot her point blank because she started driving forward towards him in a parking lot? Absolutely fucking not.

A_Good_Boy posted...

Did she make him stand in front of the car? If she did force him to stand in front of the car then why didn't the other cop stand in front of the car too?

He made a choice to stop her. He didn't choose to hurt her.
However, she chose to hit him.

Error1355 posted...

Was that the right call for the cop in this situation? Absolutely fucking not.

Not the best call sure, but why can't we say she should have talk to the officer

omniryu posted...

Not the best call sure, but why can't we say she should have talk to the officer

Because the action of shooting her is the action under scrutiny. Any reasonable person can look at this and see that while she DID break the law the serious life ending force being used here doesn't make sense. It should have never gotten to this point.

Yes she is violating the law by attempting to run, but this appears to be a non-violent crime she was being accused of if I understand this correctly.

Let the woman go, add to her charges when she gets caught, and don't escalate this to a deadly force situation.

Or are you one of the people who gets mad when the police call off a hot pursuit when they are driving 150 down a highway?

I'm very understanding of police defending themselves in a situation where there aren't any other effective methods, but...

She very very clearly turned the wheel enough to demonstrate that she couldn't run the cop over from where he was standing. His life wasn't threatened. He could tell exactly where shed go because thats how cars work. He could've avoided a nudge from a very slow moving vehicle by taking one step back, which is dramatically safer for the cop too. This is more like breaking a tackle.

https://youtu.be/foLLQ4ipY7E?si=0MzbLxHGMbNCl_VU

Jiek_Fafn posted...

She very very clearly turned the wheel enough to demonstrate that she couldn't run the cop over from where he was standing. His life wasn't threatened.

And he was in the middle of the car, if you see the video I posted prior.
Which leads me to this:

Error1355 posted...

Because the action of shooting her is the action under scrutiny. Any reasonable person can look at this and see that while she DID break the law the serious life ending force being used here doesn't make sense. It should have never gotten to this point.

Yeah, but she see the officer in front of her and she clearly made an action to violently remove him out of the way. This question I ask, what would happen if she drove off causing further harm? Why don't we think about that?

Error1355 posted...

Let the woman go, add to her charges when she gets caught, and don't escalate this to a deadly force situation.

That's short sighted. What if the car wasn't hers? What if she goes and escape?
If we stick with this principle, then you pretty much say let a murderer go because "he can get hurt "

Then let's ask ourselves this:
"What was so serious enough for her to run off, and not only run off but run off and hit a cop."

omniryu posted...

She made that choice to press down on the accelerator. He basically gave her a signal to stay.

Please show where his life was in danger in the video. We'll wait...

omniryu posted...

And he was in the middle of the car, if you see the video I posted prior.
Which leads me to this:

Yeah, but she see the officer in front of her and she clearly made an action to violently remove him out of the way. This question I ask, what would happen if she drove off causing further harm? Why don't we think about that?

That's short sighted. What if the car wasn't hers? What if she goes an escape?
If we stick with this principle, then you pretty much say let a murderer go because "he can get hurt "

If we stick with your principle, anyone accused of even a minor crime is subject to summary execution If they do not immediately surrender.

After all, you can always invent a list of things they may or may not do in the future to 'justify' the killing.

You know Judge Dredd is dystopian fiction, don't you?

omniryu posted...

why can't we say she should have talk to the officer

Multiple posters have said just that. So why are you ignoring that just to continue to argue.

omniryu posted...

That's short sighted. What if the car wasn't hers? What if she goes and escape?

Talk about short sighted, and you wanna play the what if game. You can go down the what if rabbit hole all god damn day for both parties involved, but what we see now from the body cam footage is a cop standing in front of the car, the car slowly accelerating, and the cop choosing to kill her instead of getting out of the way.

lolife67 posted...

Please show where his life was in danger in the video. We'll wait...

Where she move for and tried to hit him. That's car weigh a ton and what would happen if he is under the car? Stop pretending getting hit by a car is life threatening.

ai123 posted...

If we stick with your principle, anyone accused of even a minor crime is subject to summary execution If they do not immediately surrender.

My principle is just to detain and ID. She didn't want to be detain and she chose to hit an officer.

ai123 posted...

You know Judge Dredd is dystopian fiction, don't you?

It isn't that serious.

lolife67 posted...

Multiple posters have said just that. So why are you ignoring that just to continue to argue.

And what is their response? They say she should have talk but they should just let her go. Great move.

omniryu posted...

That's short sighted. What if the car wasn't hers? What if she goes and escape?
If we stick with this principle, then you pretty much say let a murderer go because "he can get hurt "

Then let's ask ourselves this:
"What was so serious enough for her to run off, and not only run off but run off and hit a cop."

No use trying to have a conversation with you on this if you are going to be jumping through an absolutely bonkers hypothetical that have nothing at all with this case. The police were there under suspected shoplifting, not suspected murderer. If the police are rolling up to every situation thinking the person they are talking to is a murderer then maybe that's where our fucking problem with excessive force starts.

The issue is that simply moving out of the way would have been enough for this officer to get himself into safety. Discharging the gun at her point blank is just fucking outrageous. She did stupid shit, but that shit wasn't worth a death sentence.

Gwynevere posted...

Talk about short sighted, and you wanna play the what if game. You can go down the what if rabbit hole all god damn day for both parties involved, but what we see now from the body cam footage is a cop standing in front of the car, the car slowly accelerating, and the cop choosing to kill her instead of getting out of the way.

It isn't a what if. She see someone in front of her and she literally tried to run him over to get him out of the way. That's recklessness. So what will happen if she drives off? You really think she is going to comply with traffic laws or will she tried to rush out and have a possibility hitting someone else?

Don't steal and don't flee from police. This isn't rocket science.

omniryu posted...

So what will happen if she drives off? You really think she is going to comply with traffic laws or will she tried to rush out and have a possibility hitting someone else?

'Damn, she might in the future run a red light. Better make sure we put a bullet in her now'.

Go fuck off.

I'll just repost what I said in the last one:

Yeah, while she did start moving the car as front cop was standing there (and did push him), he murdered her. Side cop is innocent though. Both of his hands were free and he was just telling her to get out. Not aggressively, just seriously.

Front cop was trigger happy, ran up and basically shot her within 10secs of appearing. He done f'd up. Even if side cop tried to best of his ability to get her out before that, front cop would've killed her. It was also side cop that broke the window to try to save her. I hope he blew his ass up on the drive back to the station.

Edit: it was definitely front cop that escalated it x10 for no reason at all. He's going to prison.

And

Side cop was not ordering her aggressively nor did he have his gun out. He was just asking her to get out of the car. He already had the situation under control actually, and the front cop was entirely unneeded. I'm actually interested to see side cop's video to see how he conducted the initial walkup and convo with her before the front cop ran up.

I suppose I can't say front cop could've just stayed back and minded his own business since that likely wasn't possible but if that guy wasn't there, she'd probably be alive today.

Error1355 posted...

No use trying to have a conversation with you on this if you are going to be jumping through an absolutely bonkers hypothetical that have nothing at all with this case. The police where there under suspected shoplifting, not suspected murderer. If the police are rolling up to every situation thinking the person they are talking to is a murderer then maybe that's where our fucking problem with excessive force starts.

I am not saying she did, I am saying but your principle. You say that if the officer can't get her out the car. They should let her go.

If that's the principle you stand on then you have to apply to other situation.

So if there's a possible murderer, which would make sense if someone would try to run away and hit a cop, you say they should be let go and find them later.

My thing is that this is a two party situation. You can de escalate a situation and not just the cops. You guys can be impractical at times.

Error1355 posted...

'Damn, she might in the future run a red light. Better make sure we put a bullet in her now'.

Go fuck off.

Or "damn she hit a guy on a motorcycle because she was in a reckless (proven in video) state, because police is bad! ACAB."

omniryu posted...

My principle is just to detain and ID. She didn't want to be detain and she chose to hit an officer.

And failing that, execution.

ai123 posted...

And failing that, self defense because she literally turn a 1-ton vehicle into a weapon.

Fixed that for you.

omniryu posted...

Fixed that for you.

You need to fix yourself, mate.

You're inventing absurd hyperbolic fictions to troll a messageboard with your support for a wholly unnecessary killing.

We get it. We know what you are.

And the crazy thing is that. No one here learns a lesson. No, we never post how to interact with the police. All everyone here post is let her get away with this. Fine, but apply it to every situation. Then no one here would never ask why did she need to steal an alcohol beverage. Is it an addiction problem? Was she manipulated by someone to get it?

No, it just, "Officer you're being lame, be cool and let them go."

ai123 posted...

You need to fix yourself, mate.

You're inventing absurd hyperbolic fictions to troll a messageboard with your support for a wholly unnecessary killing.

We get it. We know what you are.

I don't support killing, I support looking at both sides. What can be done to de-escalate a situation. We look at the situation at face value but we don't talk about what is really going on.

omniryu posted...

I don't support killing, I support looking at both sides. What can be done to de-escalate a situation. We look at the situation at face value but we don't talk about what is really going on.

The power to de-escalate lies with the cops. They (should) have the training and the predisposition to do so. They are going to meet a lot of distressed, desperate, and mentally ill people.

Yelling 'get the fuck out of the car!' does not indicate a wish to de-escalate.

ai123 posted...

The power to de-escalate lies with the cops. They (should) have the training and the predisposition to do so. They are going to meet a lot of distressed, desperate, and mentally ill people.

Yelling 'get the fuck out of the car!' does not indicate a wish to de-escalate.

And the second half of de-escalation goes to the party being detained or question. You have to learn stress management when you're facing other humans with bullets (cops). Because having policy and training doesn't mean you have 100% safety, you don't.
If she was scared that they might abuse her record a video. If she was scared of getting a record assess the situation. She wouldn't have gotten in big trouble maybe a demeanor. Take the L and go on. Then there's the media perception of the police wants to kill you when there's nuance to the whole subject.
Believe it or not you can help a cop de- escalate a situation as well.

And if you feel like that a detainee/ civilian has no obligation or responsibility too, then just admit you don't like cops and you want it just be difficult for them.

And if it is mental illness, I agree, cops should be aware of it. Let's be real, i want that training for everyone not just cops because we got one on the Switch boards and people treat him like fucking shit and that passes me off. Sorry, I got side tracked.

What I am saying is not to blame this person or that person but how do we remedy a situation from here on out.
To be clear:

1. I do acknowledge this isn't the best call the officer who stood in the front made.
2. However, some people made it out that he forced her to make that choice making it more malicious then it really was
3. We have the power to help de-escalate a situation and not just the cops
4. And never did I say the cops need more training.
5. We just need an unbiased view.

And can I say why I have these views? Because there's a harmful narrative out there. It is a rebuttal but it can be misconstrued as harmful.

I hear this several different times.

It doesn't matter if you comply or not, the police will still kill you.

People hear this and discourage them taking control of the situation and trying to reduce harm. But anyway, I am the bad guy here...