Current Events > It lowkey sucks FF7 Remake is 3 parts

(+) Yeah! (+)

I think all of this is that the idea of a Final Fantasy VII Remake was always going to be more exciting than whatever the reality was going to be.

This is about as big of an effort as they could possibly give that is still realistic and viable.

Zonbei posted...

What an insane false equivalence.

All of your equiptment and skills get outclassed within the first hour of each expansion, so it materially changes nothing, just like this, right?

Zonbei posted...

Probably keep whining forever about inconsequential things on gamefaqs, I would imagine.

I'll leave that to you. You seem a lot better at it

CheshireSimper posted...

All of your equiptment and skills get outclassed within the first hour of each expansion, so it materially changes nothing, just like this, right?

Nope. Totally different experiences, totally different systems. stop trying to compare a MMORPG to an action rpg.

gmanthebest posted...

I'll leave that to you. You seem a lot better at it

no u he said, in a way that doesnt make any sense, as Ive only said positive things about the game in this topic.

you did it. Youre a star.

Zonbei posted...

no u he said, in a way that doesnt make any sense, as Ive only said positive things about the game in this topic.

you did it. Youre a star.

Pointing out that you've only said positive things about the game is not the brag you think it is. Especially in a topic that criticizes the games.

CheshireSimper posted...

Imagine if every WoW expansion deleted your characters for "balance".

WoW has a level cap that gets raised every expansion. it makes all the gear you earned at the previous level cap completely useless.

this is for balance, because some people ended the last expansion with maxed out raid gear and most people ended it with regular old casual gear.

gmanthebest posted...

Pointing out that you've only said positive things about the game is not the brag you think it is. Especially in a topic that criticizes the games.

It wasnt meant to be a brag, only to illustrate how little sense you were making with your previous comment. I didnt have a reason to say negative things about the game here. Because, again, Im not a whiny little baby who takes every opportunity I can to whine about a videogame not being exactly as I want it, even when that particular change doesnt matter at all.

You arent very good at this, are you?

thronedfire2 posted...

WoW has a level cap that gets raised every expansion. it makes all the gear you earned at the previous level cap completely useless

Exactly, in other words, they scale story progress with level progress. No matter how many expansions they make, your character continues to progress in an ordinal manner with the story. Shocking how they can make that work.

CheshireSimper posted...

Exactly, in other words, they scale story progress with level progress. No matter how many expansions they make, your character continues to progress in an ordinal manner with the story. Shocking how they can make that work.

they actually didn't make it work at all, which is why they've had to do multiple stat squeezes and level cap resets.

thronedfire2 posted...

they actually didn't make it work at all, which is why they've had to do multiple stat squeezes and level cap resets.

Because they have an open ended game. If you have exactly 3 games, it is trivial.

Zonbei posted...

It wasnt meant to be a brag, only to illustrate how little sense you were making with your previous comment. I didnt have a reason to say negative things about the game here. Because, again, Im not a whiny little baby who takes every opportunity I can to whine about a videogame not being exactly as I want it, even when that particular change doesnt matter at all.

You arent very good at this, are you?

"Every opportunity"? I'm sorry that you think valid criticism is "whining", but it's not. Just pointing out ways it can improve. Holy hyperbole, Batman!

Did people complain about carryover for X-2 and 13-3?

CheshireSimper posted...

Because they have an open ended game. If you have exactly 3 games, it is trivial.

so first you said they made it work, now you're agreeing they didn't?

CheshireSimper posted...

Imagine if every WoW expansion deleted your characters for "balance".

I was going to bring this up myself, actually, but the other way. You ever go through your bags at the start of a new expansion and sell all your now-worthless mythic raiding gear because you got better greens from leveling quests?

CheshireSimper posted...

Because they have an open ended game. If you have exactly 3 games, it is trivial.

Stretching out the progression of one Final Fantasy game across three games isn't trivial. It would be a drastic change in how they design and plan the games across several years.

- How often does the character level up in each game
- What is the level cap for each game
- What do they hold back for the sequels
- Do they gimp materia until following games
- How do they design New Game+
Etc.

Also even though they're remaking the one game they want to advertise and sell these games as standalone releases. By drip feeding progression as well as story that makes this tricker than that already is.

thronedfire2 posted...

so first you said they made it work, now you're agreeing they didn't?

This is a strangely immature line of argument. Nothing works perfectly, nothing. I obviously meant it worked reasonably well, which it did until their multidecade spanning massive success of a game scaled up too ridiculously.

Punished_Blinx posted...

Stretching out the progression of one Final Fantasy game across three games isn't trivial. It would be a drastic change in how they design and plan the games across several years.

- How often does the character level up in each game
- What is the level cap for each game
- What do they hold back for the sequels
- Do they gimp materia until following games
- How do they design New Game+
Etc.

Also even though they're remaking the one game they want to advertise and sell these games as standalone releases. By drip feeding progression as well as story that makes this tricker than that already is.

Yup, Cid/Vincent aren't playable, so part 3 has a way to advertise them, since a lot of people want their gameplay the most.

Although they said they weren't doing dlc, I don't believe them cuz Squeenix is fully aware how much money a Vincent DLC would make, and it'll allow them to test the Part 3 mechanics just like the Yuffie DlC

CheshireSimper posted...

This is a strangely immature line of argument. Nothing works perfectly, nothing. I obviously meant it worked reasonably well, which it did until their multidecade spanning massive success of a game scaled up too ridiculously.

yeah, and the FF7 remake system also works "reasonably well"

oh and I like how you edited out the 2nd half of my post in #159

PowerOats posted...

Did people complain about carryover for X-2 and 13-3?

No, because people have gotten more and more entitled and whiny as the internet has aged.

You guys play an RPG game and lose everything going from one game to the next?

How do they not have an import system like college football and NFL games had in the mid-2000s

I was just about to buy this game

Jaguar34 posted...

You guys play an RPG game and lose everything going from one game to the next?

How do they not have an import system like college football and NFL games had in the mid-2000s

I was just about to buy this game

eyeroll

Cid isn't playable? Is the rocket level thing in Part 2 or 3?

Jaguar34 posted...

You guys play an RPG game and lose everything going from one game to the next?

How do they not have an import system like college football and NFL games had in the mid-2000s

I was just about to buy this game

mid 2000s LMAO

if you buy a sports game these days you're paying $70 for the exact same game with a roster that has to be fixed with a day 1 patch

I think the problem is, people actually wanted a remake of FF7. They didn't have to do a direct one-to-one but FF7 Remake is, ironically, anything but a "remake".

Repackaging FF7 as 3 separate games from the get-go just seems like they're exploiting people's nostalgia. There's nothing wrong with making a multi-part series of games. But I think with FF7, it's under more scrutiny.

Jaguar34 posted...

Cid isn't playable? Is the rocket level thing in Part 2 or 3?

Apparently Rocket Town is in Part 3. Cid is present doing other things

VirtuousWrath posted...

I think the problem is, people actually wanted a remake of FF7. They didn't have to do a direct one-to-one but FF7 Remake is, ironically, anything but a "remake".

Repackaging FF7 as 3 separate games from the get-go just seems like they're exploiting people's nostalgia. There's nothing wrong with making a multi-part series of games. But I think with FF7, it's under more scrutiny.

arguably, making a 1:1 remake that requires bare minimum effort, no innovation, and way less time is exploiting people's nostalgia more.

VirtuousWrath posted...

I think the problem is, people actually wanted a remake of FF7. They didn't have to do a direct one-to-one but FF7 Remake is, ironically, anything but a "remake".

Repackaging FF7 as 3 separate games from the get-go just seems like they're exploiting people's nostalgia. There's nothing wrong with making a multi-part series of games. But I think with FF7, it's under more scrutiny.

So much of Final Fantasy VII and older RPG's are left to the imagination. In a way it lead to stories and designs that are more epic than what AAA games do today because fundamentally the gameplay and design itself were simple. It's similar to a book. You're reading a story and playing over pictures more than actually exploring a realistic setting and world.

The compromise was always going to come somewhere. Games are expensive as shit to make now. Rebirth alone is absolutely massive.

Zonbei posted...

arguably, making a 1:1 remake that requires bare minimum effort, no innovation, and way less time is exploiting people's nostalgia more.

PowerOats posted...

Apparently Rocket Town is in Part 3. Cid is present doing other things

Just gonna leave that there for the class to see.

You know what's a really good remake? RE4make

FF7 Remake should've been like RE4make, an actually good game that's complete.

Also to the people not liking the world map, this should have been expected from Squeenix.

They are probably the worst devs at open world. Look how empty 16 is. There are more things to do in Bomb-omb Battlefield than half of 16.

And just think, Part 3 is most likely gonna have twice the regions

Resident Evil 4 Remake is a remake of a 3D action game on the GameCube and PS2. It's not compatible to a PS1 JRPG at all. They didn't even have to adjust the scale all that much.

Even then they still ended up removing bosses and scenarios.

VirtuousWrath posted...

Just gonna leave that there for the class to see.

You know what's a really good remake? RE4make

FF7 Remake should've been like RE4make, an actually good game that's complete.

I love RE4 Remake, but people bitched before launch thinking that the Island was cut entirely

Then they complained that the Lava Room, Gondola, and U3 and some other things were cut, and that Separate Ways was gonna be cut or DLC.

VirtuousWrath posted...

Just gonna leave that there for the class to see.

You know what's a really good remake? RE4make

FF7 Remake should've been like RE4make, an actually good game that's complete.

I dont see what point youre trying to illustrate here.

They left things for the third game in a trilogy so youll have new experiences and characters in the third one? So that somehow invalidates all the work theyve done?

Each character in FF7 Remake is leagues ahead of the ones in the original, both in story and gameplay. The originals are basically empty mannequins when it comes to combat. They have a limit break and are otherwise identical. How dare they give you all that and only give you two new characters and a ton of combo abilities for each possible teamup? Monsters.

This is what I mean about the fucking whining. Theyre putting things in the game we want so well want to play the game! So evil! Good lord, you guys understand what game design is, right? They introduce characters so you want to see more of them, then as part of the sequel they let you play as them. Pretty basic stuff. Totally normal stuff that makes games fun. sequels are supposed to add value.

And the hilarious thing is, it makes the characters better. Cid essentially has zero reason to join the party in the original. Thats also the case in rebirth, but theyre clearly going to make the rocket town stuff the reason for him to join here, and do a better job of showing him shift from a guy you know to an actual member with a grudge against shinra, instead of you stealing his plane and him deciding what the hell Ive got nothing better to do.

the lack of save carryover from Remake to Rebirth was not that huge of a deal, was a bit annoying to be given 1-2 slot gear and a handful of Materia at the start of Rebirth but it is not like you were really that far into the original game at the start of Rebirth. It will be way more of an annoyance if they do the same for part 3 and have small amounts of unleveled Materia and gear that can only fit a few pieces. Will hold judgement until the release of part 3 thou.

xsdarknesssx posted...

the lack of save carryover from Remake to Rebirth was not that huge of a deal, was a bit annoying to be given 1-2 slot gear and a handful of Materia at the start of Rebirth but it is not like you were really that far into the original game at the start of Rebirth. It will be way more of an annoyance if they do the same for part 3 and have small amounts of unleveled Materia and gear that can only fit a few pieces. Will hold judgement until the release of part 3 thou.

yeah, you may end Remake with a ton of materia, but a lot of that is because you have time to grind 3-4 of the same materia to the cap if you want. that obviously wasn't on the table for most people in the original unless you wanted to grind for like 300 hours

Cope as you must, but FF7 remake trilogy is just turning out to be a cash grab.

VirtuousWrath posted...

Cope as you must, but FF7 remake trilogy is just turning out to be a cash grab.

In the same way that every single videogame is a cash grab, yes.

It is very clear they put in a shit ton of effort. Theyve made two huge games, changed up gameplay systems TWICE, overhauled the story and characters, provided way more interaction and character development, and generally made this way harder on themselves than they needed to if it was a cash grab. Made a huge open world with tons of content that they didnt have to, which takes work. Made more minigames than ever in a remake of a game known for mjnigames. They have a vision, a vision you dont like. That is the opposite of a cash grab. A cash grab would have been playing it safe. Just do a 1:1 remake with nice graphics. Boring, cheap, easy, plays on nostalgia.

Instead they innovated at risk of people like you whining about it incessantly. Not a cash grab. No matter how many times you say it.

thronedfire2 posted...

they actually didn't make it work at all, which is why they've had to do multiple stat squeezes and level cap resets.

Personally I think selling a game with a Lv.150 level cap is a very hard sell.

thronedfire2 posted...

because every kid had a 2nd gba lying around right

Zonbei posted...

Yeah, just have two Gameboys, obviously.

(Im making fun of you, richy rich)

Borrow a friends?

Foppe posted...

Borrow a friends?

https://youtu.be/UHf0UtuWhNo?si=yhZnKi4Bd4MIIKTB

jk ILU

For Golden Sun, you could manually input the key. The GBA link was a convenience feature, not a requirement

To me, I really was not expecting save data carryover, but they honestly did their best in making the characters feel more powerful at the start of Rebirth compared to the start of Remake anyway, so it's not that jarring. Like, despite levels and Materia not carrying over, and some weapon abilities not carrying over, characters feel far more capable and the party actually keeps most of Remake's non-DLC summons.

Cloud has grown from being clumsy in the air and relatively weighty on the ground to having buttery smooth movement and free-flowing aerial combat, and he strikes faster.

Barret is hella tanky now and takes down enemies with ease. His shots are way stronger than they were in Remake.

Tifa, the best character in Remake, is even better. She can use her abilities in the air and basically keep herself in mid-air indefinitely. I think she strikes a tad bit faster too.

Aerith is much more effective as a mage now, with stealing MP from monsters allowing her to keep up with casting a lot of spells. She also starts with Arcane Ward IIRC, which lets you double cast.

CheshireSimper posted...

...just scale progress as if it were one game. That's all. Just think "i'm making multiple games that follow a single progression, let's scale things such that by the end of the last game you are roughly where we expect players to max out".

lmao imagine spending the entirety of Remake with Fire, Cure, and all the other tier 1 spells. Imagine finally getting Thundara in Rebirth only to be stuck there for the rest of the game. Imagine actually thinking this is a better system then the ones we have.

It's really obvious which of the people in this topic have actually played the games they're talking about.

Gamefreak1000 posted...

lmao imagine spending the entirety of Remake with Fire, Cure, and all the other tier 1 spells. Imagine finally getting Thundara in Rebirth only to be stuck there for the rest of the game. Imagine actually thinking this is a better system then the ones we have.

It's really obvious which of the people in this topic have actually played the games they're talking about.

Yeah, pretty much. A big part of the RPG experience is watching numbers go up and getting more powerful. If you slow that process down to a crawl for the sake of balancing across three entire games that'll last a total of 300 hours, and remove a variety of accessories and Materia, that's gonna lose its fun. The only way I could see it working is if you suggest that they add new tiers for the magic spells, which would IIRC be the first time Final Fantasy has done that.

This could work if they were doing a more basic remake where it's essentially just an HD version of the original. But then it'd fit in one game anyway. With how they're approaching this remake now, trying to fully realize the world and events of FFVII as this grand-scale RPG just like how it felt when it first released...they'd need to make a sacrifice. I'm sure the devs thought extensively about this, because to me it makes the most sense in terms of game feel to not have data transfer and instead just improve the combat and characters in each iteration to make them still feel like they're growing more powerful. All the characters in Rebirth feel more capable than they were in Remake. You can point out dot Hack all you like, dot Hack is not Final Fantasy. That series has its own set of rules that'll allow them to data transfer between games.