Current Events > pete buttigieg says "fairness" issues with transwomen in sports

(+) Yeah! (+)

Sayoria posted...

Yes it is. And shit like what Butt-edge is saying moves it in favor of the right. But it's okay. When gay marriage is overturned, he can be happy he stood up against the trans insanity opposed to sticking up for it and trying to twist the narrative back in our favor.

No, it isn't. It's something just invented out of thin air by a Libertarian crank who got disproven on it in his own lifetime and was completely forgotten until Glenn Beck wrote a shitty book

I also still do not know what you meant by "Epstein list and Clinton talks"

LightSnake posted...

No, it isn't. It's something just invented out of thin air by a Libertarian crank who got disproven on it in his own lifetime and was completely forgotten until Glenn Beck wrote a shitty book

I also still do not know what you meant by "Epstein list and Clinton talks"

The Overton Window is a thing that's been talked about in universities even. I know my poli-sci classes went over it more than enough. And even if it was 'fake', the semantics of it all are very much real as the nationalism of countries are ever-growing stronger.

And the Epstein list thing is simple

• Oh, Republicans were visiting Epstein?
• Oh, now Democrats were?
• Shit, they are both just Pedophile parties in the end!

LightSnake posted...

Also, the Overton Window isn't real

It's objectively real.

Sayoria posted...

The Overton Window is a thing that's been talked about in universities even. I know my poli-sci classes went over it more than enough. And even if it was 'fake', the semantics of it all are very much real as the nationalism of countries are ever-growing stronger.

And the Epstein list thing is simple

* Oh, Republicans were visiting Epstein?
* Oh, now Democrats were?
* Shit, they are both just Pedophile parties in the end!

Yeah, maybe promoting this conspiracy theory where both sides are just as corrupt and covering for pedophiles on their own side had some downsides like I've been saying for months now. Maybe constantly accepting "Bill Clinton went on a set of charity trips surrounded by diplomats and charity workers means he's a pedophile and that's equivalent to Trump hanging with Epsteinn for a decade" was a bad thing.

vigorm0rtis posted...

It's objectively real.

It was coined by a crank named Joseph P. Overton who thought he could make people accept unpopular positions by talking about them a lot. It's not a serious theory

He was literally John Overton?

LightSnake posted...

It was coined by a crank named Joseph P. Overton who thought he could make people accept unpopular positions by talking about them a lot. It's not a serious theory

You know what else was coined by people? Various scientific theories.

If something exists, it exists.

Sayoria posted...

You know what else was coined by people? Various scientific theories.

If something exists, it exists.

Again with the "If". Most institutions don't take it seriously, and Overton himself failed miserably with it. It was forgotten for years until Glenn Beck used it as the title for his shitty book

LightSnake posted...

Again with the "If". Most institutions don't take it seriously, and Overton himself failed miserably with it. It was forgotten for years until Glenn Beck used it as the title for his shitty book

Explain to me what makes the theory of it 'fake'.

Because it assumes a binary line of left and right where the window shifts along that access judging by who talks about it most and simply talking about it is enough to make people accept it.

The standard libertarian nonsense Overton pushed were unpopular and have remained unpopular.

Whether it's real or not we can look at how the conversation on immigration has changed since 2016. I remember in Trump's first term the dems as a whole were very pro immigrant, they spoke about how good they were for our country, they didn't cede ground so much to talk of criminals and gangs. The border wall was seen as a laughing stock. Now they keep the border wall, they no longer make fun of it. Immigration is now an "issue" to be solved vs people coming to our country to become citizens and make our country better.

Maybe it is partially how the media portrays it, but it really feels like the range of what dems are willing to say on immigration has shifted to the right over the past 8-9 years.

El_Dustino posted...

Whether it's real or not we can look at how the conversation on immigration has changed since 2016. I remember in Trump's first term the dems as a whole were very pro immigrant, they spoke about how good they were for our country, they didn't cede ground so much to talk of criminals and gangs. The border wall was seen as a laughing stock. Now they keep the border wall, they no longer make fun of it. Immigration is now an "issue" to be solved vs people coming to our country to become citizens and make our country better.

Maybe it is partially how the media portrays it, but it really feels like the range of what dems are willing to say on immigration has shifted to the right over the past 8-9 years.

I feel some people also feel everything can be prevented if Dems would just say the right thing when the big story in 2023 was.... images of chaos at the border packaged as a breakdown of the nations social order and a threat to its very identity. Coupled with a mass turn of economic chaos, hyping up stories of violence out of context, etc. which led to feelings of discontentment that turn to nationalism. And it's also a much more serious concern to republicans and swing voters than Democrats

LightSnake posted...

Because it assumes a binary line of left and right where the window shifts along that access judging by who talks about it most and simply talking about it is enough to make people accept it.

The standard libertarian nonsense Overton pushed were unpopular and have remained unpopular.

There are left ideas and there are right ideas. Simply put, ideas that are, or once were left, are leaving the political sphere in support of more right-views ON the left. The overton window still takes into consideration that there's not strictly a binary but on a scale of it all, there are still people far left and far right with the lack of the binary in the center. The issue is, people are skewing evermore to the right. What is the result? "Oh, Trans people in sports ARE a problem! ..... The border IS a problem!" ..... and more takes to which the democrats typically stood against becoming part of their own political platforms. Why? Because yes, the 'tides have changed' and democrats instead of pulling the window back in their favor, are chasing it.

I called this in like January that libs were gonna turn on trans people. Us Hispanics are on the chopping block next. Mfs suck shit.

Democrats' poll numbers are in the shitter because their base wants to go further to the left, and they go to the right.

Dumbasses.

Sayoria posted...

There are left ideas and there are right ideas. Simply put, ideas that are, or once were left, are leaving the political sphere in support of more right-views ON the left. The overton window still takes into consideration that there's not strictly a binary but on a scale of it all, there are still people far left and far right with the lack of the binary in the center. The issue is, people are skewing evermore to the right. What is the result? "Oh, Trans people in sports ARE a problem! ..... The border IS a problem!" ..... and more takes to which the democrats typically stood against becoming part of their own political platforms. Why? Because yes, the 'tides have changed' and democrats instead of pulling the window back in their favor, are chasing it.

This assumes politics can be easily won by politicians just saying the right things. Sometimes it's not a mtter of arguments you win or lose with facts or strong words

LightSnake posted...

I feel some people also feel everything can be prevented if Dems would just say the right thing when the big story in 2023 was.... images of chaos at the border packaged as a breakdown of the nations social order and a threat to its very identity. Coupled with a mass turn of economic chaos, hyping up stories of violence out of context, etc. which led to feelings of discontentment that turn to nationalism. And it's also a much more serious concern to republicans and swing voters than Democrats

Prevent everything? No. Cushion the blow to mitigate some of the damage? Yes. By 2023 the dems had already shifted their speech on immigration and the border so they did not set themselves up for success. It unfortunately relies on democrats having consistent and strong values which they, not as individuals but as a party, are not known for at the moment.

Dems have no majority but the least they can do is not cede ground to Republicans. The border being such an achillies heel for them was, in part, a mess of their own making. That is the kind of weakness of the party they can and should be preventing.

How is this incident with Pete the equivalent of the democrats turning on trans people?

MotaroRIP619 posted...

How is this incident with Pete the equivalent of the democrats turning on trans people?

People are assuming we are going to see more dems start distancing themselves from trans rights. Pete is not the first one, Newsome already did this. After the election some of the consultant/pundit class were blaming trans people for Harris' loss.

It's too early to say it WILL happen but it's starting to become a trend.

El_Dustino posted...

People are assuming we are going to see more dems start distancing themselves from trans rights. Pete is not the first one, Newsome already did this. After the election some of the consultant/pundit class were blaming trans people for Harris' loss.

It's too early to say it WILL happen but it's starting to become a trend.

Let's absolutely agree this is a concern, and crack down on them doing so while praising thm when they do the right thing and give props to Dems like Pritzker and beshear for not doing this.

LightSnake posted...

This assumes politics can be easily won by politicians just saying the right things. Sometimes it's not a mtter of arguments you win or lose with facts or strong words

Right, because politics are best won by slamming a minority for a while and instead of debunking the insanity people have around those minorities.

Gay people are next. And I cannot wait for Buttigieg to be like 'Wait, what now?!?!?'.

There's three things that can be done:

• Attack trans people
• Stay quiet
• DEBUNK THE STUPIDITY

Guess which one Butt Edge took here? Are you saying the best option here is to attack trans people? Because that's what you are saying. The facts are that trans people are such a small minority. Butt Edge could easily point to how these assholes are impacting not just sports, but passports, will to live, military services and so much more and how this has nothing to do with Sports but an outright 'death to trans people' march. But no, we want to die on the hill of 'Okay, you know what, trans people in sports IS a problem, the Republicans are correct!'.

Nobody here is praising Buttigieg and calling him "Butt Edge" is just weird and offputting.

LightSnake posted...

Nobody here is praising Buttigieg and calling him "Butt Edge" is just weird and offputting.

Then stop acting like a dipshit about it. I swear to God every interaction I have with you is like this. And given all the topics I see you in, you like this shit a little too much.

LightSnake posted...

the big story in 2023 was.... images of chaos at the border packaged as a breakdown of the nations social order and a threat to its very identity.

The big story will always be whatever looks worst for the Democratic candidate. Where there is no story of that sort one will be invented. Old age! Emails! John Kerry's swift boat!

Sayoria posted...

Then stop acting like a dipshit about it. I swear to God every interaction I have with you is like this. And given all the topics I see you in, you like this shit a little too much.

Your participation is voluntary. You want to engage in this, be my guest. You're not entitled to do it without pushback. Find another spot if that bothers you so much.

LightSnake posted...

Your participation is voluntary. You want to engage in this, be my guest. You're not entitled to do it without pushback. Find another spot if that bothers you so much.

Exactly what I expected. Thanks for not denying the point that you look to elevate hostility with your interactions.

Sayoria posted...

Exactly what I expected. Thanks for not denying the point that you look to elevate hostility with your interactions.

You're the one who keeps seeking out conflicts, leaving insults on random posts of mine here. You want to be wrong? Again, that's your right. Other people have a right to push back on that and your reaction to it is often meltdowns and shrieking insults.

Life's hard for all of us. Deal with it better or find a new place. I do not "look" for hostility. You just constantly start it and then complain when it's returned.

LightSnake posted...

You're the one who keeps seeking out conflicts, leaving insults on random posts of mine here. You want to be wrong? Again, that's your right. Other people have a right to push back on that and your reaction to it is often meltdowns and shrieking insults.

Life's hard for all of us. Deal with it better or find a new place. I do not "look" for hostility. You just constantly start it and then complain when it's returned.

It's how I play. If you are a dumbass, I call out your-being-a-dumbass. When a thread pops up and it clearly imposes a threat about the 'pro-LGBT party' looking to FUCK OVER TRANS PEOPLE, I get pissed and am going to use harsh language and criticize the bastards.

And I start it? Pal, this all started because you don't believe the concept of what the Overton Window is and you believe politics cannot be won over by saying the right things. People are scared of the unknown and need to be taught that 'the different' isn't scary. For fuck sakes, I don't leave my house without a fucking mask on because I am afraid of getting killed in this environment and captain privilege here is going to side with Republicans and just push more anti-trans rhetoric. One of the guys I should be voting for in 2028? Get the fuck out of here.

Sayoria posted...

Right, because politics are best won by slamming a minority for a while and instead of debunking the insanity people have around those minorities.

Gay people are next. And I cannot wait for Buttigieg to be like 'Wait, what now?!?!?'.

There's three things that can be done:

* Attack trans people
* Stay quiet
* DEBUNK THE STUPIDITY
Guess which one Butt Edge took here? Are you saying the best option here is to attack trans people? Because that's what you are saying. The facts are that trans people are such a small minority. Butt Edge could easily point to how these assholes are impacting not just sports, but passports, will to live, military services and so much more and how this has nothing to do with Sports but an outright 'death to trans people' march. But no, we want to die on the hill of 'Okay, you know what, trans people in sports IS a problem, the Republicans are correct!'.

From the article I read he didnt attack the minority. He also went out of his way to condemn what the Republicans were doing.

MotaroRIP619 posted...

From the article I read he didnt attack the minority. He also went out of his way to condemn what the Republicans were doing.

Condemning doesn't sound like debunking to me. That sounds like 'Stop being bad, leave them alone' which I group with 'stay quiet'.

Americans have some incredibly weird level of caring about children's sports that this is even an issue.

LightSnake posted...

Let's absolutely agree this is a concern, and crack down on them doing so while praising thm when they do the right thing and give props to Dems like Pritzker and beshear for not doing this.

That sounds reasonable

I was just responding to Motaro seeming unsure why trans people would see this isolated incident as part of a potential broader trend.

Sayoria posted...

It's how I play. If you are a dumbass, I call out your-being-a-dumbass. When a thread pops up and it clearly imposes a threat about the 'pro-LGBT party' looking to FUCK OVER TRANS PEOPLE, I get pissed and am going to use harsh language and criticize the bastards.

So you admit you throw around insults and then get at pushback. Okay.

W're all agreeing buttigieg's statement sucks. You're making a bit much of it to transpose to the entire party

And I start it? Pal, this all started because you don't believe the concept of what the Overton Window

Still not a thing. Also, this is a bit funny to me. Imagine "disagreement on the existence of the Overton Window" as a thing to get mad about

is and you believe politics cannot be won over by saying the right things. People are scared of the unknown and need to be taught that 'the different' isn't scary. For fuck sakes, I don't leave my house without a fucking mask on because I am afraid of getting killed in this environment and captain privilege here is going to side with Republicans and just push more anti-trans rhetoric. One of the guys I should be voting for in 2028? Get the fuck out of here.

I'm an LGBT Jew in a heavily Nazi-infested area in Florida who's been the victim of an antisemitic hate crime in the past. Maybe don't assume shit about someone next time.

And literally nobody here has said "vote for Buttigieg."

BewmHedshot posted...

Americans have some incredibly weird level of caring about children's sports that this is even an issue.

Boy I'll say.

BewmHedshot posted...

Americans have some incredibly weird level of caring about children's sports that this is even an issue.

Yes. We have a fucked up society where we actually reward people who play sports well with admission into colleges for some reason

LightSnake posted...

So you admit you throw around insults and then get at pushback. Okay.

W're all agreeing buttigieg's statement sucks. You're making a bit much of it to transpose to the entire party

Still not a thing. Also, this is a bit funny to me. Imagine "disagreement on the existence of the Overton Window" as a thing to get mad about

I'm an LGBT Jew in a heavily Nazi-infested area in Florida who's been the victim of an antisemitic hate crime in the past. Maybe don't assume shit about someone next time.

And literally nobody here has said "vote for Buttigieg."

Cool.

KhlavicLanguage posted...

polling on the issue must be pretty severe to see this backtracking among democratic politicians. maybe america will wisen up someday

I think basically all Republicans and well above half of Dems don't support it. I have to find the poll but yeah, it's wildy unpopular iirc.

Poll: Most Americans oppose trans women competing in female sports, including 2 of 3 in Gen Z https://share.google/KvJxz703gbpCwP6YR

It's like 75%

MotaroRIP619 posted...

How is this incident with Pete the equivalent of the democrats turning on trans people?

It's not. But people are frustrated, lash out, and then use their trans identity to try to justify spreading both sides bullshit

Which gets incredibly tiring to watch

Gwynevere posted...

It's not. But people are frustrated, lash out, and then use their trans identity to try to justify spreading both sides bullshit

Which gets incredibly tiring to watch

Excuse me for calling out democrats for being fucking assholes. Silly of me to expect a little fucking defense from that party.

If a third dem presidential hopeful cedes grounds on whether trans people belong in sports do we get to have an issue with the party then?

I want to know where all the trans athletes that dominates everything are.
It should be easy to name a handful if it is such a problem, right?
A single name?

Foppe posted...

I want to know where all the trans athletes that dominates everything are.
It should be easy to name a handful if it is such a problem, right?
A single name?

Only two trans athletes have competed at the Olympics, and neither were close to a medal.

Competing at the elite level is extremely difficult for trans athletes. The governing bodies either outright ban them, or put them through a battery of testing. The amount of barriers put up makes an ambition that is hard for anyone near impossible. Concern about trans athletes dominating the top level is just fearmongering.

Most of the noise is coming from people who don't want trans athletes competing in amateur, college, or school sports. Which always seems fucked up to me because at any level below pro/elite, sport should be about participation and inclusion.

Pete is spineless. He always has been.

He's an empty suit that's being propped up by neoliberal and corporate interests as the next Obama

except Obama was actually charismatic

pretzelcoatl posted...

I think basically all Republicans and well above half of Dems don't support it. I have to find the poll but yeah, it's wildy unpopular iirc.

Poll: Most Americans oppose trans women competing in female sports, including 2 of 3 in Gen Z https://share.google/KvJxz703gbpCwP6YR

It's like 75%

And I think a big part is that the GOP set the time and narrative and was left to wildly run roughshod with it.

It became a hot button issue because they won't shut the fuck up about it, and I really don't think surrendering to their framing in any way will help.

Sayoria posted...

Excuse me for calling out democrats for being fucking assholes. Silly of me to expect a little fucking defense from that party.

I get better legal protections in the Democrat led city I live in than I would in the deep red shit hole counties surrounding it. Dems are a big party, if you have issues with them then focus on getting the bad ones out

I support transwomen....

But I dont think the majority of the US ever will and anyone campaigning on this will lose. Just keep it part of your agenda without mentioning it.

CARRRNE_ASADA posted...

I support transwomen....

But I dont think the majority of the US ever will and anyone campaigning on this will lose. Just keep it part of your agenda without mentioning it.

until the terf queen started pumping huge amounts of money into propaganda

support for us was going up

CARRRNE_ASADA posted...

I support transwomen....

But I dont think the majority of the US ever will and anyone campaigning on this will lose. Just keep it part of your agenda without mentioning it.

just like gay marriage?