Current Events > do you think "git gud" is useless smuggery, or genuine advice

(+) Yeah! (+)

no in-between for this poll. as a member of soulsborne communities for over a decade, i have only ever seen it as useless smuggery (and unearned, at that)

if someone wanted to give advice, theyd give advice. they wouldnt say "just simply win" imo

It depends. There are situations where it could be, but probably rarely when it comes to video games, especially the really hard ones.

I prefer Blake's "the fool who persists in his folly will become wise."

it makes sense in dark souls, where you actually have to spend the time memorizing move sets for bosses. elsewhere its mostly just assholes though.

monkmith posted...

it makes sense in dark souls, where you actually have to spend the time memorizing move sets for bosses. elsewhere its mostly just assholes though.

imo it doesnt make sense anywhere, since all its saying is "improve"

thats not advice that makes sense ever. someone asking for help or airing a grievance already knows "improve"

Its because of stuff like that, I tend to spam a lot in multiplayer games

or make low hp builds in dark souls/elden ring

It's an annoying and cliche way to respond, but the meaning behind it can be valid depending on the thing being complained about. Like if someone complained that they keep dying in a bullet hell shooter - that craziness is part of the genre's appeal, my man. You gotta either get better or try a different game.

I think there are rare instances where gear and stats can't be changed to give you some advantage and there is really nothing to improve from that standpoint or like a game where it is purely just skill like a bullet hell shooter and it simply comes down to there isn't much to say but you need to play better. Be able to recognize patterns and have better timing and hand eye/coordination and all that.

But in the context of From Software fanboys lets be real we know what it is.

the people that say it are almost always just useless smug shitposters. But there are times when skill issue is the correct answer

It depends on the context. If it's used sincerely in place of advice, it's useless smuggery, but if it's used semi-tongue-in-cheek in conjunction with explaining that something is just hard and there's no trick to making it easier, it's fine.

Dungeater posted...

imo it doesnt make sense anywhere, since all its saying is "improve"

Which one should try to do.

As lets not pretend there isnt a plethora of entitled little whiners online that think the world should bend over backwards to let them win using a playstyle they prefer fighting. Or devs should bend to something they like.

I dont personally use the phrase (only because its not really my vocabulary), but Im definitely behind the sentiment for people like the above.

So my answer to this topic is, it depends.

Rika_Furude posted...

the people that say it are almost always just useless smug shitposters. But there are times when skill issue is the correct answer

"skill issue" is the problem most of the time, sure, but just saying it isnt doing anything to help someone asking for advice. whenever someone makes a thread asking for help or airing out a flaw i try to give them some ideas or say what worked for me. why would i just reply "youre just not good enough", right?

asdf8562 posted...

Which one should try to do.

they know that. everyone knows that

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/f/fcbfd8f7.jpg

It depends on what it's a response to.

Okay:
"This boss is bullshit!"
"git gud"

Not okay:
"How do I dodge this attack?"
"git gud"

Useless smug shit.

It's a gaming version of "It's easy to be rich. Just stop being poor."

The concept itself isn't exactly wrong.

But when it's just the declaration without guidance or help, then it's as useless as an asshole on a cactus.

Dungeater posted...

"skill issue" is the problem most of the time, sure, but just saying it isnt doing anything to help someone asking for advice. whenever someone makes a thread asking for help or airing out a flaw i try to give them some ideas or say what worked for me. why would i just reply "youre just not good enough", right?

Sometimes they arent looking for advice

99.9% of the time, it's just to taunt and troll someone who's complaining, just like skill issue

Dungeater posted...

they know that. everyone knows that

False. Everyone doesnt know that.

Its actually dishonest to claim everyone does, given many actually demand others players or the developers accommodate them.

The idea that everyone is genuinely looking to improve when they complain about something is just beyond untrue.

Should it be used against someone genuinely seeking help? No. But lets not sit here and pretend everyone is doing that, and that there's isnt entitled whiners looking to be accommodated.

Its snarky so I think its only fair when its a response to something snarky

Tyranthraxus posted...

Okay:
"This boss is bullshit!"
"git gud"

i guess i just don't understand. my inclination is to be like "yea hes a tough one, do you want some help?"

if someone is obviously venting i wouldnt wanna push their buttons. theyre already frustrated. and i cant see "git gud" as anything but that

asdf8562 posted...

False. Everyone doesnt know that.

Its actually dishonest to claim everyone does, given many actually demand others players or the developers accommodate them.

The idea that everyone is genuinely looking to improve when they complain about something is just beyond untrue.

fella be schruteposting

Dungeater posted...

"skill issue" is the problem most of the time, sure, but just saying it isnt doing anything to help someone asking for advice. whenever someone makes a thread asking for help or airing out a flaw i try to give them some ideas or say what worked for me. why would i just reply "youre just not good enough", right?

Saying it comes down to skill can be a way to confirm there's really nothing else they're missing - e.g. there are no tricks or varying strategies for that situation to know about, you just have to keep trying. "Git guud" is douchey, though.

"git gud" on its own is useless, providing advice on builds/enemies/game mechanics alongside is much better.

not all at once cuz that can get overwhelming, but stuff like, "hey with more carry weight, you can get better roll speed and distance with light armours, or you can wear heavier armours to tank the hits better" (game dependent of course)

Dungeater posted...

fella be schruteposting

Sounds like projection given what you are trying to push.

People who brag about their supposed superiority over a game's difficulty is never warranted lol. Especially over a topic that's largely subjective. The whiners who complained about the MK World patch that made things like Knockout Tour "easier" were particularly insufferable. Accessibility is key.

Dungeater posted...

fella be schruteposting

What does schruteposting mean?

rick_alverado posted...

What does schruteposting mean?

posting like dwight schrute

Dungeater posted...

posting like dwight schrute

Ah, I see. Is it just because of the "False."? I know that is a Dwight-ism, but the post didn't otherwise seem very Dwight-esque to me.

rick_alverado posted...

Ah, I see. Is it just because of the "False."? I know that is a Dwight-ism, but the post didn't otherwise seem very Dwight-esque to me.

the whole post

It's cleary snarky and intended to annoy. If you really want to break it down to the dirty bare bones of communication, you'd at least spell it "get good" imo, if there was any sincere aspect to it

Its a part of demons souls. I still prefer that game over Elden Ring especially the remake. The combat feels more visceral for some reason. But I am not good Im terrible

It's not about being right. It's about how you say it, and "git gud" just isn't that helpful.

"You want an easy solution. There isn't one. Anyone who has done the thing has spent dozens/hundreds of hours training, improving, and getting stronger. You are lazy and it's painfully obvious you'll never have the grit or drive to accomplish anything worth talking about."

"Git gud"

Dungeater posted...

i guess i just don't understand. my inclination is to be like "yea hes a tough one, do you want some help?"

if someone is obviously venting i wouldnt wanna push their buttons. theyre already frustrated. and i cant see "git gud" as anything but that

Putting forward a drive by criticism with no justification or elaboration is unhelpful to everyone involved. Hence the unhelpful response.

There's, of course, option 3, which is to just not say anything at all.

why would venting need justification or elaboration?

gud god if u cant handle someone saying 'git gud' at you you ain't never gonna beat that boss

people get weirdly defensive and protective over their games, even when they have absolutely nothing to gain by defending Shitbutte, Deposed Lord of the Ancient Poo Poo City

viewmaster_pi posted...

people get weirdly defensive and protective over their games, even when they have absolutely nothing to gain by defending Shitbutte, Deposed Lord of the Ancient Poo Poo City

that boss would go so hard

Robot2600 posted...

gud god if u cant handle someone saying 'git gud' at you you ain't never gonna beat that boss

you're doing it now, you're only in here to be annoying because... i don't know, i genuinely don't know what triggers this behavior

viewmaster_pi posted...

you're doing it now, you're only in here to be annoying because... i don't know, i genuinely don't know what triggers this behavior

i assumed they were being ironic but yea

Dungeater posted...

why would venting need justification or elaboration?

The onus is on the person initiating the conversation to do so in a respectful way. Starting a conversation with ad hominem (ad gameinem?) and a dismissal of opinions to the contrary is antagonist.

I gave an extremely specific example, "This boss is bullshit!" A sentence which, posted on its own, would probably get modded on any of the game boards. It does not apply to all forms of venting.

I still don't get it. let someone be frustrated without poking their buttons, offer help if they want or need it

what's so hard about that. everyones gotten frustrated at a game before

https://youtube.com/watch?v=blSXTZ3Nihs

Dungeater posted...

I still don't get it. let someone be frustrated without poking their buttons, offer help if they want or need it

what's so hard about that. everyones gotten frustrated at a game before

you're starting to get into problems with how people treat each other online in general. who cares about being nice or patient or reasonable when i can be a quippy funny troll for updoots?

1.Just a meme
2.Dismissal of a ridiculous post
3.Genuine advice
4.Dismissal of a reasonable post

And that's probably the order of likelihood you'll see it used.

It's most commonly used as a meme. Pretty self-explanatory, but will be used even in situations where it doesn't make sense, like in response to someone not getting a random drop.

Next up will be dismissal of a ridiculous post. There are people who just posts their frustrations and are immune to logic. Naturally, it'd be a waste of time and effort on your part to give them a thought out response. These people aren't looking to improve, they're looking for people to mirror their complaints so that they can feel validated.

As for genuine advice, it's typically not good advice, as most who would need that advice aren't capable of discerning what it means. A lot of times, telling someone that they just need to tidy up the basics is all they need. I've seen countless people on the Souls boards ask, boss after boss, "how do I beat it" and everyone gives them the bad replies of "oh, here's a cheese strat" rather than tell them the reality of the situation "just keep at it and learn the basics". Learning the basics will allow you to solo every single Souls boss. Learning a cheese strat may only be limited to a few.

Sometimes someone who is venting needs to be told the basic truth, "just practice and get better". For a lot of us who play challenges in game, we already tell ourselves that, but there are a lot of players who will either ignore it or see it as something insurmountable, despite it being relatively easy. At some point, you'd come to the realization that if people on a forum are saying it, and most people on forums are notoriously bad at video games, that getting to their level isn't something that takes long.

As for dismissal of reasonable complaints, these are just the fanboy responses. Granted, anyone who is just looking for an echo chamber will label all of the categories as this one, but there are people so far up a game's ass that they think complaints aren't valid.

Dungeater posted...

let someone be frustrated without poking their buttons, offer help if they want or need it

what's so hard about that. everyones gotten frustrated at a game before

People should be allowed to be frustrated, sure. But if you bring that circus to a discussion board, you have to share it with everyone.

viewmaster_pi posted...

you're doing it now, you're only in here to be annoying because... i don't know, i genuinely don't know what triggers this behavior

Dungeater posted...

i assumed they were being ironic but yea

the entire topic is this, yall are doing it now. you're only making this topic to be annoying because... actually i do know--to project some kind of weird self-righteousness.

the topic is confrontational and designed to provoke while appearing not to provoke. this is a constant thing.

Robot2600 posted...

the entire topic is this, yall are doing it now. you're only making this topic to be annoying because... actually i do know--to project some kind of weird self-righteousness.

the topic is confrontational and designed to provoke while appearing not to provoke. this is a constant thing.

that's not rly a thing i do. i dont care to annoy people and i dont know why its such a common sentiment. if im being antagonistic im very direct about it. i also dont feel any self righteousness over this and idk why ur responding the way that u are

Depends on what the person is trying to do. The more specific they are on what they need advice on, the better a person can respond. If you're just having trouble on a standard boss battle and are asking for help, the only real advice can be to get better at dodging and timing attacks.