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OctilIery 12/20/18 12:02:12 PM #201: |
artowen74 posted...
Funkydog posted...artowen74 posted...Funkydog posted...Nick_Saban posted...The political left is basically just trying to brand everything they disagree with as some sort of horrible atrocity. The endgame isn't equality, it's the inability to be conservative without repercussions. That just makes you kind of an ass. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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artowen74 12/20/18 12:03:25 PM #202: |
PleaseClap posted...
PleaseClap posted...iClockwork posted...OctilIery posted...iClockwork posted...OctilIery posted...artowen74 posted...Big difference between true gender and gender identity And we all know this part was added within the last few decades as to maintain a neutrality that encompasses various viewpoints. --- Now Playing: AC:Odyssey/Diablo 3:U.E.E./Spider-Man/Hopping back and forth between 50+ Indies, lol. RIP Hiroki Tobias; you're loved. :( ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darklit_Minuet 12/20/18 12:05:57 PM #203: |
HenryAllbright posted...
And second, you're completely ignoring the reason why the baker doesn't want to make the cake. You don't have to like his reason, and that's fine, but to pretend like it doesn't exist and therefore conclude that he isn't receiving harm? That's just...weird, dude. His reason is objectively wrong, therefore it doesn't apply. It would be like me saying I don't want to work because the sky is red and boss tells me I'm fired if I don't come in. My belief in something fraudulent and stupid does not supersede my work obligations ... Copied to Clipboard!
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artowen74 12/20/18 12:09:54 PM #204: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
HenryAllbright posted...And second, you're completely ignoring the reason why the baker doesn't want to make the cake. You don't have to like his reason, and that's fine, but to pretend like it doesn't exist and therefore conclude that he isn't receiving harm? That's just...weird, dude. Sure it applies; he's not going to fire himself no matter the belief systems involved. As far as your comments about stupidity, see the perfectly valid 'cat argument.' One cannot be something they're not. --- Now Playing: AC:Odyssey/Diablo 3:U.E.E./Spider-Man/Hopping back and forth between 50+ Indies, lol. RIP Hiroki Tobias; you're loved. :( ... Copied to Clipboard!
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andel 12/20/18 12:10:18 PM #205: |
artowen74 posted...
andel posted...artowen74 posted...andel posted...there isn't even any biblical basis to discriminate against trans people. it isnt legitimate for them to discriminate against gay people either but in this scenario they can't even point to any biblical scripture that says anything against trans people so him claiming religion here is even more bullshit than before you are adding context that isnt there to try and stretch. obviously the bible is an outdated book of myths anyway but it doesnt justify discriminating against trans people (and doesnt justify any kind of discrimination anyway as something being a 'sin' isnt any justification for not associating with people). adultery is a 'sin' but these people dont deny making cake for known adulterers. --- I am thinking about just walking into the river now that Megaupload is gone and condoms are in porn.-Fubonis ... Copied to Clipboard!
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hockeybub89 12/20/18 12:12:36 PM #206: |
Where in the Bible does it mention not dealing with trans people?
--- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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HenryAllbright 12/20/18 12:14:43 PM #207: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
HenryAllbright posted...And second, you're completely ignoring the reason why the baker doesn't want to make the cake. You don't have to like his reason, and that's fine, but to pretend like it doesn't exist and therefore conclude that he isn't receiving harm? That's just...weird, dude. Not being a bigot starts and ends with not judging another person's opinion as worse than your own. --- All points of view and perspectives exist for a reason. There is no such thing as evil. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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hockeybub89 12/20/18 12:16:17 PM #208: |
HenryAllbright posted...
Darklit_Minuet posted...HenryAllbright posted...And second, you're completely ignoring the reason why the baker doesn't want to make the cake. You don't have to like his reason, and that's fine, but to pretend like it doesn't exist and therefore conclude that he isn't receiving harm? That's just...weird, dude. Does this mean we can't judge white supremacists lest we become bigots? --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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andel 12/20/18 12:17:20 PM #209: |
hockeybub89 posted...
Where in the Bible does it mention not dealing with trans people? it doesnt and it doesnt justify not dealing with gay people either. jesus explicitly lead by example by associating with prostitutes, these religious nuts just ignore stuff like that and try (and fail) to use it as a crutch to justify their hatred --- I am thinking about just walking into the river now that Megaupload is gone and condoms are in porn.-Fubonis ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Squall28 12/20/18 12:17:57 PM #210: |
OctilIery posted...
Squall28 posted...Modern science doesn't support gender bullshit at all. Source of study who's basis isn't CIS is the standard. --- If you're going through hell, keep going. -Winston Churchill ... Copied to Clipboard!
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artowen74 12/20/18 12:18:26 PM #211: |
andel posted...
artowen74 posted...andel posted...artowen74 posted...andel posted...there isn't even any biblical basis to discriminate against trans people. it isnt legitimate for them to discriminate against gay people either but in this scenario they can't even point to any biblical scripture that says anything against trans people so him claiming religion here is even more bullshit than before Trying to stretch? Wow, lol; you're turning a blind eye to context just to stand ground that has already been lost tbqh. You've been friendly about this, so I'll simply say that we're done here. --- Now Playing: AC:Odyssey/Diablo 3:U.E.E./Spider-Man/Hopping back and forth between 50+ Indies, lol. RIP Hiroki Tobias; you're loved. :( ... Copied to Clipboard!
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The_Ivory_Man 12/20/18 12:18:45 PM #212: |
OctilIery posted...
Minor nitpick: For it to be considered discrimination, avoid worded cakes. They could easily say "I wouldn't write that for anyone", and win the case. It's when they refuse a cake they WOULD make for someone else that they are discriminating. Both of these cases asked for custom made cakes, not just a cake. --- "Just because someone is killed doesn't mean they died" - Shojikan ... Copied to Clipboard!
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hockeybub89 12/20/18 12:19:17 PM #213: |
andel posted...
hockeybub89 posted...Where in the Bible does it mention not dealing with trans people? They also can't figure out if the Old Testament still counts or not. Depends on who they want to discriminate against I guess. --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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HenryAllbright 12/20/18 12:21:38 PM #214: |
hockeybub89 posted...
HenryAllbright posted...Darklit_Minuet posted...HenryAllbright posted...And second, you're completely ignoring the reason why the baker doesn't want to make the cake. You don't have to like his reason, and that's fine, but to pretend like it doesn't exist and therefore conclude that he isn't receiving harm? That's just...weird, dude. I am not saying you can't take action if white supremacists try to hurt people. --- All points of view and perspectives exist for a reason. There is no such thing as evil. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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andel 12/20/18 12:22:14 PM #215: |
artowen74 posted...
andel posted...artowen74 posted...andel posted...artowen74 posted...andel posted...there isn't even any biblical basis to discriminate against trans people. it isnt legitimate for them to discriminate against gay people either but in this scenario they can't even point to any biblical scripture that says anything against trans people so him claiming religion here is even more bullshit than before so you are admitting you have no argument and retreating to a safe space eh? i accept your admittance that you lost. --- I am thinking about just walking into the river now that Megaupload is gone and condoms are in porn.-Fubonis ... Copied to Clipboard!
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OprahJimfrey 12/20/18 12:22:59 PM #216: |
We should start a go fund me for these bakers.
... Copied to Clipboard!
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andel 12/20/18 12:23:03 PM #217: |
hockeybub89 posted...
andel posted...hockeybub89 posted...Where in the Bible does it mention not dealing with trans people? well at least it is easy to use their own attempted justification against them and make them back down when they have no rebuttal --- I am thinking about just walking into the river now that Megaupload is gone and condoms are in porn.-Fubonis ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Funkydog 12/20/18 12:23:56 PM #218: |
HenryAllbright posted...
Funkydog posted...HenryAllbright posted...I just said that I wouldn't refuse service to anyone if I was a baker. That seems to be a lot of your guys' definition of the word, so why does that suddenly not apply to me? Why let these things start in the first place? Discrimination is crap, no matter how small. And it only takes it getting a foothold to spread. --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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HenryAllbright 12/20/18 12:34:09 PM #219: |
Funkydog posted...
HenryAllbright posted...Funkydog posted...HenryAllbright posted...I just said that I wouldn't refuse service to anyone if I was a baker. That seems to be a lot of your guys' definition of the word, so why does that suddenly not apply to me? Because of diminishing returns. At this point we are looking to spend a shitload of society's resources and piss a lot of people off so that less than the 1% of bakeries out there who would have otherwise refused service will be forced to make cakes. Is that really worth it? --- All points of view and perspectives exist for a reason. There is no such thing as evil. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SaithSayer 12/20/18 12:41:48 PM #220: |
1. Find place of business with religious owners.
2. Ask them to do something that goes against their beliefs. 3. Make a big deal about one of X amount of places you could use not giving you what you want. 4. Turn social media into your own army. 5. Feel powerful by forcing someone to compromise their principles rather than going about things the right way and eventually seeing real acceptance. Smart. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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artowen74 12/20/18 12:43:32 PM #221: |
SaithSayer posted...
1. Find place of business with religious owners. +1 --- Now Playing: AC:Odyssey/Diablo 3:U.E.E./Spider-Man/Hopping back and forth between 50+ Indies, lol. RIP Hiroki Tobias; you're loved. :( ... Copied to Clipboard!
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HenryAllbright 12/20/18 12:46:02 PM #222: |
SaithSayer posted...
1. Find place of business with religious owners. 6. Compare what you're doing to the work people did during the Civil Rights movement. --- All points of view and perspectives exist for a reason. There is no such thing as evil. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Funkydog 12/20/18 12:52:40 PM #223: |
HenryAllbright posted...
Because of diminishing returns. At this point we are looking to spend a shitload of society's resources and piss a lot of people off so that less than the 1% of bakeries out there who would have otherwise refused service will be forced to make cakes. Is that really worth it? If so many people are upset at not being allowed to discriminate then clearly not a small issue, is it? --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SaithSayer 12/20/18 12:55:54 PM #224: |
HenryAllbright posted...
SaithSayer posted...1. Find place of business with religious owners. The world has changed. Back then it would've led to almost every place of business turning black people away. Now all you have to do is get the word out that a place discriminates in any way and then people can choose whether or not they want to continue to give them their money. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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KILBOTz 12/20/18 1:03:01 PM #225: |
In the original case the baker offered to sell any already prepared baked goods to the gay couple but wouldn't make a custom creation for them. I haven't read that specifically in this case, but I would assume he took the same approach. If so, I'm totally fine with it. A public store needs to offer the goods it has to the public, I don't think an individual should be forced to create something specifically against their believes though.
--- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darklit_Minuet 12/20/18 1:04:18 PM #226: |
KILBOTz posted...
I don't think an individual should be forced to create something specifically against their believes though. His beliefs are wrong and should be fixed ... Copied to Clipboard!
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KILBOTz 12/20/18 1:06:06 PM #227: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
KILBOTz posted...I don't think an individual should be forced to create something specifically against their believes though. Your desire for thought control is a bit gross. --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SaithSayer 12/20/18 1:06:48 PM #228: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
KILBOTz posted...I don't think an individual should be forced to create something specifically against their believes though. Forcing them is the Magneto way to go about it. Be Charles. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darklit_Minuet 12/20/18 1:08:10 PM #229: |
KILBOTz posted...
Your desire for thought control is a bit gross. It's not control, it's adjustment. We should shame and mock him into believing the right thing, at the cost of his business and personal life and anything else it takes. His kind has been doing this to us for millennia, time for him to be on the other side of the coin. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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HenryAllbright 12/20/18 1:09:02 PM #230: |
Funkydog posted...
HenryAllbright posted...Because of diminishing returns. At this point we are looking to spend a shitload of society's resources and piss a lot of people off so that less than the 1% of bakeries out there who would have otherwise refused service will be forced to make cakes. Is that really worth it? It pisses people off because of the principle of the matter, not because everyone who would be pissed at the outcome would necessarily discriminate the same way. --- All points of view and perspectives exist for a reason. There is no such thing as evil. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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voldothegr8 12/20/18 1:09:44 PM #231: |
HenryAllbright posted...
SaithSayer posted...1. Find place of business with religious owners. Why do libs keep comparing this to the civil rights movement? Aside from the fact that was over 5 decades ago, every US citizen is equal under the word of law in 2018. This cake issue has nothing to do with government oppression. So lets please stop with this fallacy. --- Oda break tracker 2018- 9 (3) | THE Ohio State: 12-1 | Oakland Raiders: 3-11 Super Mario Maker Profile: 1237-0000-0073-02FE ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SaithSayer 12/20/18 1:12:22 PM #232: |
No decent human being says "his kind". You sound villainous.
... Copied to Clipboard!
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KILBOTz 12/20/18 1:12:53 PM #233: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
KILBOTz posted...Your desire for thought control is a bit gross. That sounds vindictive and like your desire is to harm those who believe differently than you, not actually resolve and heal differences. --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Funkydog 12/20/18 1:15:03 PM #234: |
HenryAllbright posted...
Funkydog posted...HenryAllbright posted...Because of diminishing returns. At this point we are looking to spend a shitload of society's resources and piss a lot of people off so that less than the 1% of bakeries out there who would have otherwise refused service will be forced to make cakes. Is that really worth it? Still don't see how that changes matters. Just further shows that the matter is more important and relevant than you say. People being upset that others aren't allowed to use their religion to discriminate should be met with derision not nods of the head. --- ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darklit_Minuet 12/20/18 1:16:40 PM #235: |
KILBOTz posted...
That sounds vindictive and like your desire is to harm those who believe differently than you, not actually resolve and heal differences. If his kind wanted to actually resolve and heal differences, I would too. But they don't, so why should we? ... Copied to Clipboard!
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artowen74 12/20/18 1:23:34 PM #236: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
KILBOTz posted...Your desire for thought control is a bit gross. "The right thing," maybe right by you but plenty of dictators and megalomaniacs throughout the ages have believed that they were doing "The right thing." Folks could argue that the LGBT community should be "shamed and mocked," into "believing the right thing," doesn't make it right though. I swear you SJWs are the worst; can't leave the guy alone to his own beliefs, you wanna pester and ridicule people into conforming, hell, crucify people who don't share your own beliefs and lifestyles. If it's the other way around you get out the torches and pitchforks. You bring shame to the LGBT community and humanity in general. "The right thing," smmfh. --- Now Playing: AC:Odyssey/Diablo 3:U.E.E./Spider-Man/Hopping back and forth between 50+ Indies, lol. RIP Hiroki Tobias; you're loved. :( ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darklit_Minuet 12/20/18 1:25:10 PM #237: |
artowen74 posted...
Folks could argue that the LGBT community should be "shamed and mocked," into "believing the right thing," doesn't make it right though. It has been shamed and mocked. This is balancing out the scales. If one side of the scale has a lot of weight on it, you need an equal amount on the other side to balance it out ... Copied to Clipboard!
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artowen74 12/20/18 1:26:05 PM #238: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
KILBOTz posted...That sounds vindictive and like your desire is to harm those who believe differently than you, not actually resolve and heal differences. "His kind," smmfh. You really can't help yourself, so just go away, you're done...really. --- Now Playing: AC:Odyssey/Diablo 3:U.E.E./Spider-Man/Hopping back and forth between 50+ Indies, lol. RIP Hiroki Tobias; you're loved. :( ... Copied to Clipboard!
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SaithSayer 12/20/18 1:26:08 PM #239: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
KILBOTz posted...That sounds vindictive and like your desire is to harm those who believe differently than you, not actually resolve and heal differences. See, guys? Magneto. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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artowen74 12/20/18 1:27:06 PM #240: |
Darklit_Minuet posted...
artowen74 posted...Folks could argue that the LGBT community should be "shamed and mocked," into "believing the right thing," doesn't make it right though. Spoken like a true dictator. Good day. --- Now Playing: AC:Odyssey/Diablo 3:U.E.E./Spider-Man/Hopping back and forth between 50+ Indies, lol. RIP Hiroki Tobias; you're loved. :( ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darklit_Minuet 12/20/18 1:28:09 PM #241: |
artowen74 posted...
Darklit_Minuet posted...artowen74 posted...Folks could argue that the LGBT community should be "shamed and mocked," into "believing the right thing," doesn't make it right though. A dictator controls the powerless. I want to bring those with power down to scale and even things out. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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PhazonReborn 12/20/18 1:30:35 PM #242: |
I'm all about equal rights.
But why can't the dude just bake fucking cakes in peace? If he doesnt want to make a cake, why should he have to? This is just dumb. Go to another bakery ffs --- The Phazon you know and trust since 2004 ... Copied to Clipboard!
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creativerealms 12/20/18 1:31:38 PM #243: |
How do you "find a business with a religious owner?" With a few exceptions you can't outwardly know that a bakery, florist, or other store is owned by a religious person. Take for instance many of the cases where same sex couples were turned away from the bakery. Many times they were customers for years, even friends and the religious issue never came up. Being Christian and being a bakery never intersected until they wanted to buy a wedding cake. There is no such thing as a Christian Bakery like there are Jewish bakeries.
Often times it's not the left trying to start a conflict. --- Sarcasm is my basic function. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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PleaseClap 12/20/18 1:33:06 PM #244: |
PhazonReborn posted...
I'm all about equal rights. I don't think that certain groups of people should have to rely on separate but equal facilities --- Please ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Shadow Flare 12/20/18 1:33:58 PM #245: |
ScazarMeltex posted...
Maybe if he wasn't a bigot this wouldn't keep happening. Government etc has no right to interfere in business or the workplace. Regardless of this guys views, he was within his human and constitutional rights --- War is where the young and stupid are tricked by the old and bitter into killing each other. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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PleaseClap 12/20/18 1:35:10 PM #246: |
Shadow Flare posted...
Government etc has no right to interfere in business or the workplace. Do we seriously have to explain the concept of business regulations and laws to you --- Please ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Darklit_Minuet 12/20/18 1:35:22 PM #247: |
PhazonReborn posted...
But why can't the dude just bake fucking cakes in peace? If he doesnt want to make a cake, why should he have to? This is just dumb. Go to another bakery ffs If he wants to just bake cakes for a specific clientelle, he's free to start up a private cake club. But no, he owns a public-facing business. As such, he's not allowed to discriminate against the public. Nobody forced him to open a public-facing business. ... Copied to Clipboard!
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sktgamer_13dude 12/20/18 1:35:58 PM #248: |
Maybe he should stop refusing business because his book of stories told him that gays are bad!!!
Hiding behind your religion to be an ass to someone is a weak argument, especially in America. End of story. But keep deflecting to theres other stores!!!! (enabling hate) and but muh Islam!!!!! (literally has nothing to do with this story). --- https://imgur.com/jWVrg9U https://imgur.com/g2efUtT https://imgur.com/5dOwhaP https://imgur.com/LVdqu8J Go Cougs and M's #DI4B ... Copied to Clipboard!
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wronganswerfool 12/20/18 1:36:44 PM #249: |
PhazonReborn posted...
I'm all about equal rights. If he doesn't want to make a cake, he probably shouldn't be running a business where he's expected to serve customers ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Ryuko_Chan 12/20/18 1:36:50 PM #250: |
KILBOTz posted...
Darklit_Minuet posted...KILBOTz posted...I don't think an individual should be forced to create something specifically against their believes though. --- https://i.imgtc.com/LCLKlZX.gif Life Fiber Kamui SENKETSU! ... Copied to Clipboard!
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