Board 8 > Best All-Purpose Wrestling Topic of the Decade, Part 492

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Steiner
11/29/19 5:52:44 PM
#1:


it's time to get reflective
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TheRock1525
11/29/19 6:26:41 PM
#2:


Carl's Stone Cold Lock of the Century

...of the Week
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Fastbreak
11/30/19 2:44:05 PM
#3:


Tag

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TheRock1525
11/30/19 5:34:44 PM
#4:


More AEW rankings!

https://www.cagesideseats.com/2019/11/30/20988929/aew-rankings-nov-29-moxley-number-1
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ninkendo
11/30/19 5:35:56 PM
#5:


When's everyone's $6500 Fiend belt arriving
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Fastbreak
11/30/19 8:52:49 PM
#6:


Watching this weeka stuff now

Seth Rollins is just meta trips now

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_PandaMaster_
11/30/19 9:07:06 PM
#7:


Did we talk about Sheamus adopting the "cruiserweights better cruiserWAIT, Fella!" gimmick? We should talk about that!


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TheRock1525
11/30/19 11:45:09 PM
#8:


https://twitter.com/davemeltzerWON/status/1200833484169736192?s=19

Well then.
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TheRock1525
12/01/19 1:26:13 AM
#9:


Wait wait wait wait wait.

I thought Cody losing meant he could never challenge Jericho again for the AEW championship.

Tony Kahn is saying that Cody can't challenge for the title ever again?
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Jakyl25
12/01/19 1:28:24 AM
#10:


Cody said never again for that title, period
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TheRock1525
12/01/19 1:29:55 AM
#11:


That is super dumb. Like Vince at his worst dumb.
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Jakyl25
12/01/19 1:36:03 AM
#12:


They say they want to prove to people that when they make stips like that, you can trust that they are legit.

Not like a WWE firing which means nothing
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TheRock1525
12/01/19 1:45:41 AM
#13:


But then why get invested into Cody? He can literally never be champion. He can never be the top babyface. You put all this effort into getting him massively over for nothing. You're essentially Braun Strowmanning him but stupidly publically admitting you're never gonna put the title on him.

Like the sensible stip was only while Jericho was champ. Then when you inevitably put the title on MJF you have a ready-made babyface with a history with the guy to challenge him.

How did they fuck this up so badly? They're making me honest-to-goodness hope they're liars otherwise they're idiots.
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PrivateBiscuit1
12/01/19 1:52:23 AM
#14:


Pretty sure all of this is so that they have enough of an uproar for Cody to get another shot from the audiences to really make it seem special when he gives himself another shot.
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XIII_rocks
12/01/19 2:47:04 AM
#15:


TheRock1525 posted...
But then why get invested into Cody? He can literally never be champion. He can never be the top babyface. You put all this effort into getting him massively over for nothing. You're essentially Braun Strowmanning him but stupidly publically admitting you're never gonna put the title on him.


Unless you build a hot feud or more that transcends the championship?

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FFDragon
12/01/19 2:51:42 AM
#16:


This is one of the best things they've done and I for one eagerly await the Cody descent into madness storyline.
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ninkendo
12/01/19 9:55:55 AM
#17:


but will he wear a paper bag over his head
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ExThaNemesis
12/01/19 10:42:13 AM
#18:


Rock, your anger at that decision is one of your more bizarre takes that I've ever seen, and I usually find you pretty bizarre anyway.
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TheRock1525
12/01/19 11:23:59 AM
#19:


"I can't be invested in Braun Strowman because I know he'll never be world champ."

"I can't be invested in Cody because I know he'll never be world champ."

"OMG HOW BIZARRE A TAKE"
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TheRock1525
12/01/19 11:27:06 AM
#20:


I mean Extha you literally threw a fit because NJPW didn't let your favorite guy be world champ.
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Jakyl25
12/01/19 11:42:12 AM
#21:


Part of the idea also is to keep the person in charge away from the title, to demonstrate how hes not Triple H

You may have noticed he made a subtle statement in that direction at Double or Nothing
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TheRock1525
12/01/19 11:53:09 AM
#22:


Jakyl25 posted...
Part of the idea also is to keep the person in charge away from the title, to demonstrate how hes not Triple H

You may have noticed he made a subtle statement in that direction at Double or Nothing


But (and I think Alvarez said it) you don't TELL your audience that. Because there might come a time where Cody challenging or outright winning it might be best for the company. And even as an EVP and that you think you shouldn't hold the title, you don't inform the audience of that. It's not like the Bucks or Omega aren't VPs as well? And they didn't even do it in the main event spot of the PPV to show how big of a deal it was.

It just doesn't make any sense to tie your hands so quickly and then be forced to walk it back because Cody absolutely needs to be world champ at some point.
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FFDragon
12/01/19 11:54:45 AM
#23:


ok rocker
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Maniac64
12/01/19 12:13:37 PM
#24:


I mean I get what Rock is saying.

Quack clearly feels he same as Cody about holding the title while in charge and has no intention of ever being grand champion, but when he challenges it is a big deal. And I'm glad to be able to hope he will give himself a short reign at some point.

Cody has limited AEWs future options just to make a point.

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Jakyl25
12/01/19 12:16:39 PM
#25:


PrivateBiscuit1 posted...
Pretty sure all of this is so that they have enough of an uproar for Cody to get another shot from the audiences to really make it seem special when he gives himself another shot.


I think this is the most logical thing

But it undermines their mission statement of taking stipulations seriously
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TheRock1525
12/01/19 12:22:52 PM
#26:


And they still keep him in the rankings.
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Jakyl25
12/01/19 12:35:34 PM
#27:


They said its because in real sports, you still get ranked even if you cant get a title shot or a playoff berth.

The only relevant comparison I can think of is college football, and its murky. Teams on postseason bans still get ranked in the AP Poll, but not the Coaches Poll or the CFP Rankings
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TheRock1525
12/01/19 12:42:39 PM
#28:


I got to believe the way they're going to get out of it is say that Cody can't challenge for a title but someone can challenge Cody and put the title on the line.
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Jakyl25
12/01/19 2:05:59 PM
#29:


I worry that theyll introduce a secondary title and use Cody to get it over

They dont need a secondary singles title. They could maybe add Trios titles and down the line Womens Tag, and thats it.
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Maniac64
12/01/19 3:05:41 PM
#30:


A secondary title held by Cody gets really weird.

If Cody is the top guy on the roster and has the top title he can get then wouldnt that make it the top title?

Edit: Though that could make for a good storyline.

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TheRock1525
12/01/19 3:23:34 PM
#31:


I thought the Diamond Ring is their secondary title.
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Jakyl25
12/02/19 4:32:35 PM
#32:


AEW: 663k
NXT: 810k

AEW still won every demo except 50+
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Lopen
12/02/19 4:37:36 PM
#33:


TheRock1525 posted...
I got to believe the way they're going to get out of it is say that Cody can't challenge for a title but someone can challenge Cody and put the title on the line.


This is what I was expecting as their out. And to me that's fine and doesn't undermine the stip at all.

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TheRock1525
12/02/19 4:41:01 PM
#34:


It absolutely undermines it but its preferable to the alternative.
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Lopen
12/02/19 4:41:39 PM
#35:


Also you could go another way

Cody goes heel at some point by being upset he can't challenge for the title, creates his own title which in some ways has more prestige than the real title because Cody is a big name. Real title holder can then challenge him title vs title to get rid of his dumb fake title.

You can also make him focus on tag/trios in the meantime to give those divisions some more weight.

I dunno I think there are a lot of potential ways out of it that make for some good storytelling if they go for it, even ignoring the obvious "why can't he just fight in feuds that don't involve titles" solution.

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HashtagSEP
12/02/19 4:41:53 PM
#36:


NXT's slowly starting to win out over AEW for me.

Both fill the "WWE but better" role at the same time, but AEW has a little too many RAW-like antics at times.
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TheRock1525
12/02/19 4:41:57 PM
#37:


Jakyl25 posted...
AEW: 663k
NXT: 810k

AEW still won every demo except 50+


The Wednesday Night Wars.

Where in a year we'll probably be asking if they will combine for a million viewers.
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TheRock1525
12/02/19 4:43:05 PM
#38:


HashtagSEP posted...
NXT's slowly starting to win out over AEW for me.

Both fill the "WWE but better" role at the same time, but AEW has a little too many RAW-like antics at times.


You mean Cody going from feuding with Chris Jericho for the world title to getting beat up by some guys working for a lady in a bunny mask wasn't a great decision?
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Lopen
12/02/19 4:45:35 PM
#39:


TheRock1525 posted...
getting beat up by some guys working for a lady in a bunny mask wasn't a great decision?


Seriously what even was that.

Why did Excalibur even know their names (the audience even chanted "who are you?" for a bit when the first guy attacked)

I can't even be too surprised that NXT won convincingly this week because it was definitely the weakest episode of AEW by a lot.

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HashtagSEP
12/02/19 4:45:54 PM
#40:


TheRock1525 posted...
HashtagSEP posted...
NXT's slowly starting to win out over AEW for me.

Both fill the "WWE but better" role at the same time, but AEW has a little too many RAW-like antics at times.


You mean Cody going from feuding with Chris Jericho for the world title to getting beat up by some guys working for a lady in a bunny mask wasn't a great decision?


I enjoyed that but for all the wrong reasons.

It just felt so WCW

"Who is that?!"
"OH MY GOD, IT'S THE BLADE!"
Crowd: who the fuck
"AND HE'S WITH THE BUTCHER!"
Crowd: that doesn't help
"AND THERE'S THE BUNNY!"
Crowd: oh okay i know her wait what

Like I was waiting for The Yetee and Robocop.

And fake Cody.
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HashtagSEP
12/02/19 4:47:33 PM
#41:


Lopen posted...
Why did Excalibur even know their names (the audience even chanted "who are you?" for a bit when the first guy attacked)


Honestly I think it would've been much better if he didn't and just acted confused. Instead if came off like "don't you recognize The Blade you morons?"

No.

No we don't.
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ninkendo
12/02/19 4:47:39 PM
#42:


I was as confused as JR during that segment
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TheRock1525
12/02/19 4:50:25 PM
#43:


The problem isn't Ex knowing who they are.

Its Ex knowing who they are and not explaining it.
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TheRock1525
12/02/19 4:56:35 PM
#44:


I also feel like both shows are struggling for actual storylines beyond "FACTION WARFARE" but at least NXT had Survivor Series as an excuse. I'm waiting for guys like PAC to work into storylines more. NXT also has UE leaning over everything and it is getting kinda boring since they've held all the titles since the end of the first episode.
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HashtagSEP
12/02/19 4:57:32 PM
#45:


Also why did they come out through the ring

Kane coming through the ring makes sense.
Fiend coming through the ring makes sense.

Why are three seemingly normalish people chilling under the ring.
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TheRock1525
12/02/19 5:02:20 PM
#46:


I guess you need a guy named The Blade to cut through the canvas.
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Lopen
12/02/19 5:18:10 PM
#47:


Yeah I feel like AEW has laid groundwork for a lot of interesting storylines but hasn't actually committed to any of them yet and is largely sustaining off of random matches and the Inner Circle pissing people off. Random good matches but still random matches.

Like Pac vs Moxley had a good setup for a fun feud and I feel like they ruined the main draw of it (Pac's record being unblemished except by Moxley) by having Omega just beat Pac on a no build match on Dynamite.

Janela vs Kenny Omega could have been a good filler feud that led to something but was just a good match followed by a good match with Janela randomly feuding with the that goth dude over a staple gun for no reason.

The women's division was building up Shiida as a contender vs Riho but then has her lose in a tag match.

I also couldn't really tell you any feuds currently going other than Cody vs three randos. And I guess Lucha Bros vs Best Friends? I don't know.

Like I think the Jericho segment with Virgil to start the show was funny but I feel like when you only have 2 hours of programming a week and try to give good matches with a lot of your time, you really need to pick the purpose of your interview segments very carefully, and book very carefully.

AEW segments feel a lot like output from a TEW autobooker. In some ways that's good because it makes the shows feel less formulaic but I do need a bit more direction than what they've been doing since the PPV.

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TheRock1525
12/02/19 5:23:16 PM
#48:


To AEW's credit, they've managed to avoid really any significantly dumb booking, but by the sounds of it from a Moxley interview there's basically no structure and he described the shows as "a big jam session." Which basically yes will avoid wrestlers from getting thrown into dumb storylines because Heyman/McMahon think cuck storylines are such good shit. But then without structure I'm not sure you can build long term.
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Jakyl25
12/02/19 5:23:24 PM
#49:


TheRock1525 posted...
The problem isn't Ex knowing who they are.

Its Ex knowing who they are and not explaining it.


What kind of AEW fan are you if you dont watch...Beyond Wrestling Uncharted Territory
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TheRock1525
12/02/19 5:25:32 PM
#50:


Jakyl25 posted...
TheRock1525 posted...
The problem isn't Ex knowing who they are.

Its Ex knowing who they are and not explaining it.


What kind of AEW fan are you if you dont watch...Beyond Wrestling Uncharted Territory


Funnily enough, they acronym sums up a lot of people's reaction to their debut.

"THE BLADE!"
"The B... wut?"
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