Board 8 > Wonder Woman - 90%+ on rottentomatoes

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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:02:54 PM
#151:


SupremeZero posted...
scarletspeed7 posted...
Ego's master plan was awful. There were absolutely no stakes to it. For me, that hurts Ego. Furthermore, this system of making characters villains of the week with no staying power is turning me off to Marvel movies. At some point, these villains need to stick around, develop, evolve in response to their battles with the heroes. Stop killing characters off for no reason.

You say, while acting as if killing people in comics has ever mattered.

That's the thing. It has and it does. Yes, there are certain writers and events that have destroyed meaning of life and death, but there are a ton of great comics where death matters. Sandman, Starman, Transmetropolitan, Preacher, Walking Dead, Authority, Fables, The Death of Superman, etc. And when it takes place over years instead of hours, it has more impact.
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Surskit
06/05/17 1:06:17 PM
#152:


I saw it yesterday and thought it was enjoyable, if a little too cheesy at parts. The incompetence shown by the Germans was a little too over the top, and the villain reveal was kinda silly; felt like a twist for the sake of a twist.

I'm not big on superhero movies in general but I had a good time.
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SupremeZero
06/05/17 1:06:23 PM
#153:


LapisLazuli posted...
SupremeZero posted...
scarletspeed7 posted...
Ego's master plan was awful. There were absolutely no stakes to it. For me, that hurts Ego. Furthermore, this system of making characters villains of the week with no staying power is turning me off to Marvel movies. At some point, these villains need to stick around, develop, evolve in response to their battles with the heroes. Stop killing characters off for no reason.

You say, while acting as if killing people in comics has ever mattered.


Yeah, because there's hundreds of issues.

How does that apply to the movies at all?

We're ALREADY having this happen. Coulson died and came back, The Mandarin died and turned out to essentially be a doombot, Odin died, and seems to be on his way back, and this is ignoring characters who died and came back in the same movie, like JARVIS as Vision.

Hell, here with DC, Superman died, but literally no one walked out of the theater thinking that was going to stick, and they've got a fraction of the movie count.
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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:08:05 PM
#154:


You're not getting it still. In comics, killing people has often mattered and still does (not at Marvel as much, the last meaningful death was Ultimate Spider-Man). In the movies, it started out not mattering immediately.
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KamikazePotato
06/05/17 1:08:24 PM
#155:


Best MCU villain is the dude from Civil War

No powers, clear motive, and actually succeeds
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SupremeZero
06/05/17 1:08:54 PM
#156:


scarletspeed7 posted...
You're not getting it still. In comics, killing people has often mattered and still does (not at Marvel as much, the last meaningful death was Ultimate Spider-Man). In the movies, it started out not mattering immediately.

I get what you're saying, and I agree that it's valid, I'm just arguing with the idea that the "Comics kill people and bring them back like nothing" doesn't apply to movies. Hence that being what was quoted.
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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:09:01 PM
#157:


Succeeds at killing himself because of how boring the movie is.
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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:10:21 PM
#158:


SupremeZero posted...
scarletspeed7 posted...
You're not getting it still. In comics, killing people has often mattered and still does (not at Marvel as much, the last meaningful death was Ultimate Spider-Man). In the movies, it started out not mattering immediately.

I get what you're saying, and I agree that it's valid, I'm just arguing with the idea that the "Comics kill people and bring them back like nothing" doesn't apply to movies. Hence that being what was quoted.

Movies are movies. Comics are comics. I think comics can get away with it much easier because they've got years of storylines going on and a host of content coming out weekly. The MCU puts out 13 hours of content in theaters, and they throw in the towel on every villain in every movie.
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SupremeZero
06/05/17 1:20:06 PM
#159:


scarletspeed7 posted...
SupremeZero posted...
scarletspeed7 posted...
You're not getting it still. In comics, killing people has often mattered and still does (not at Marvel as much, the last meaningful death was Ultimate Spider-Man). In the movies, it started out not mattering immediately.

I get what you're saying, and I agree that it's valid, I'm just arguing with the idea that the "Comics kill people and bring them back like nothing" doesn't apply to movies. Hence that being what was quoted.

Movies are movies. Comics are comics. I think comics can get away with it much easier because they've got years of storylines going on and a host of content coming out weekly. The MCU puts out 13 hours of content in theaters, and they throw in the towel on every villain in every movie.

There's also the fact that comics are basically set on continuing, and even when they get cancelled, they still get a chance to finish things up, which movies generally don't.

And, uh, not to disagree with the concept, but a fair amount of the villains have survived their initial films. And they generally proceed to do what you're asking for. Loki aside, Ross (As much as you consider him the villain of Hulk, anyway/care that Hulk happened), Zola, Hydra (yes I'm counting the organization, the current head generally doesn't matter hugely outside of Red Skull), and BUCKY have all survived and done exactly what you're asking for, and while they haven't done anything yet, Zemo, Dormammu, and I'm pretty sure Whiplash all survived their movies. And Zemo and Dormammu get passes because there haven't even been movies in their areas since their debut.
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Metal_DK
06/05/17 1:34:11 PM
#160:


scarletspeed7 posted...
Ego's master plan was awful. There were absolutely no stakes to it. For me, that hurts Ego. Furthermore, this system of making characters villains of the week with no staying power is turning me off to Marvel movies. At some point, these villains need to stick around, develop, evolve in response to their battles with the heroes. Stop killing characters off for no reason.


Who in the MCU has been good and long term besides Loki? Don't say Ultron, he was better than Mickey Rourke with some whips, but he wasnt a good villain and also had similar stakes but none of the emotional attachment ego had with quill at least. Loki is the only villain that has been worth a damn in the entire MCU, but Ego was at least well acted and had some development in Guardians 2. But the entire MCU has the problem honestly, and at least Ego did ok as a 1 time villain i guess
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DoomTheGyarados
06/05/17 1:35:13 PM
#161:


I enjoyed Red Skull, for what he was.
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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:40:17 PM
#162:


Can't say I disagree with any of that, DK

Supreme, I would argue that Zola is not a primary antagonist (and he died), Abomination was the marketed antagonist (and he died probably), Bucky is not the primary antagonist in any film, HYDRA isn't a villain, Dormammu wasn't the primary antagonist... and Zemo killed himself. Justin Hammer was the primary antagonist in Iron Man 2.

I agree that villains survive, but the villains that do survive are the second-stringers that never come back, the redeemable hero-villains, or the villains that will be the primary antagonists later when they will be killed off. There is no evolution or development for villains.
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SupremeZero
06/05/17 1:40:59 PM
#163:


scarletspeed7 posted...
Can't say I disagree with any of that, DK

Supreme, I would argue that Zola is not a primary antagonist (and he died), Abomination was the marketed antagonist (and he died probably), Bucky is not the primary antagonist in any film, HYDRA isn't a villain, Dormammu wasn't the primary antagonist... and Zemo killed himself. Justin Hammer was the primary antagonist in Iron Man 2.

I agree that villains survive, but the villains that do survive are the second-stringers that never come back, the redeemable hero-villains, or the villains that will be the primary antagonists later when they will be killed off. There is no evolution or development for villains.

Uh.

Scarlet.

Did you, yknow, actually watch Civil War.

Because Zemo lived.

They made that extremely, abundantly clear.
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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:42:05 PM
#164:


Didn't he kill himself at the end? I'll admit I was so bored in that movie that small details might have escaped me. I remember him shooting himself. If he didn't, that's great. Let's get him back.
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TheRock1525
06/05/17 1:43:24 PM
#165:


scarletspeed7 posted...
Didn't he kill himself at the end? I'll admit I was so bored in that movie that small details might have escaped me. I remember him shooting himself. If he didn't, that's great. Let's get him back.


He was about to shoot himself and Black Panther stopped him.
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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:44:45 PM
#166:


Oh, that's right! Totally forgot about that.
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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:48:48 PM
#167:


Now that I think about it, Zemo is the perfect guy to use to start a Thunderbolts team. Maybe they'll actually get a true secondary property out there.
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Bane_Of_Despair
06/05/17 1:53:57 PM
#168:


Ego is definitely near the top in terms of temporary villains even if his plan was nonsensical from the point of view of us viewers outside the universe
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scarletspeed7
06/05/17 1:55:57 PM
#169:


I think it wasn't about being nonsensical for me (I think any space-based villain like this is going to feel nonsensical, but Guardians itself is based on that goofiness). I think it just had no stakes. I didn't know any of the places being swallowed up by Ego's um "Ego". If we had seen Avengers Tower being hammered by blue putty, or the Nova Corps homeworld, or something like that, it would have felt more meaningful to me. Instead, it was a handful of nameless planets and Missouri. All of these places could be full of serial rapists for all I know.

But that's probably being very nitpicky, I know.
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LapisLazuli
06/05/17 1:57:51 PM
#170:


MCU villains as a whole have been....underwhelming. hell, I'd even take the villains in some of the worst DC movies over some of them. Literally Hector Hammond.
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DeathChicken
06/05/17 2:01:41 PM
#171:


Loki was a pretty damn good villain in Thor 1. Guy was a screwball, but he was a screwball for plausible enough reasons

Then the later movies turned him into a generic cackling supervillain, but still
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HeroDelTiempo17
06/05/17 2:18:47 PM
#172:


LapisLazuli posted...
MCU villains as a whole have been....underwhelming. hell, I'd even take the villains in some of the worst DC movies over some of them. Literally Hector Hammond.


Whoa man, let's not get crazy here and insinuate the Green Lantern movie had acceptable villains. The villains were probably the worst part!
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PrivateBiscuit1
06/05/17 10:22:01 PM
#173:


http://io9.gizmodo.com/wonder-womans-most-fantastic-scene-nearly-didnt-get-mad-1795811939

Prepare to have your minds blown by the sheer incompetence of Warner/DC Execs.
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ExThaNemesis
06/05/17 10:22:36 PM
#174:


Almost got a bunch of stuff spoiled by unmarked spoilers for non WW movies running through this topic so you guys might wanna chill on that.

Saw it tonight, was thoroughly impressed. I'm very fatigued on superhero movies but this one was awesome. Gal Godot was great, and this film felt really cohesive.
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swordz9
06/05/17 11:43:19 PM
#175:


I can see the "wrong body" thing, but on the other hand there probably aren't very many actresses as physically built as Wonder Woman.
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SpikeDragon
06/05/17 11:51:24 PM
#176:


Her body looks fine to me! :)
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swordz9
06/05/17 11:58:21 PM
#177:


Yeah, she looks really good. I doubt anybody attracted to women would think otherwise. She's a slender fit though. I don't think anybody would say she looks physically strong or muscular.
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scarletspeed7
06/06/17 12:00:08 AM
#178:


Honestly, in most comics, Wonder Woman doesn't look much more than slender and athletic. I say this as someone who actually reads Wonder Woman.
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MrGreenonion
06/06/17 12:39:55 AM
#179:


scarletspeed7 posted...
I think it wasn't about being nonsensical for me (I think any space-based villain like this is going to feel nonsensical, but Guardians itself is based on that goofiness). I think it just had no stakes. I didn't know any of the places being swallowed up by Ego's um "Ego". If we had seen Avengers Tower being hammered by blue putty, or the Nova Corps homeworld, or something like that, it would have felt more meaningful to me. Instead, it was a handful of nameless planets and Missouri. All of these places could be full of serial rapists for all I know.

But that's probably being very nitpicky, I know.

What kinda weirded me out was that GotG2 was set a few weeks after GotG1, whereas most other Marvel movies are set roughly around their time of release. So the blue goo in Missouri happened before Ultron, Ant-Man, Civil War, and Doctor Strange, not to mention seasons 2-4 of Agents of SHIELD and all the Netflix series. But nobody ever mentioned it.
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redrocket_pub
06/06/17 9:59:40 PM
#180:


Bane_Of_Despair posted...
Ego is definitely near the top in terms of temporary villains even if his plan was nonsensical from the point of view of us viewers outside the universe


Does it at least make sense in universe?
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swordz9
06/06/17 10:01:07 PM
#181:


Going to see this Friday I think unless something comes up
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azuarc
06/06/17 11:08:50 PM
#182:


Saw the movie tonight. Enjoyed it, even if I did see a couple places where it could have been tightened.
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scarletspeed7
06/06/17 11:23:31 PM
#183:


Can I post here about other DCEU films?

Joss Whedon is doing reshoots on Justice League.

I really am floored that he's getting this much leeway. Should be interesting how he does so late in the game.
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HaRRicH
06/07/17 12:10:27 AM
#184:


Just watched Wonder Woman...solid!
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Eddv
06/07/17 12:11:46 AM
#185:


scarletspeed7 posted...
Can I post here about other DCEU films?

Joss Whedon is doing reshoots on Justice League.

I really am floored that he's getting this much leeway. Should be interesting how he does so late in the game.


Might be changing the tone of sone scene sor maybe emphasizing wonder woman more after this was such a hit
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swordz9
06/08/17 1:23:08 PM
#186:


Looking forward to seeing this. I did see Lego Batman and it was pretty great
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scarletspeed7
06/08/17 7:50:48 PM
#187:


It looks like the box office projections predict that Wonder Woman will beat The Mummy this weekend. Which should be really bad for the Universal Horrorverse and simultaneously a little bit hilarious to watch.
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swordz9
06/08/17 7:53:17 PM
#188:


I didn't even know about the new Mummy until recently and was even more surprised it was starring Tom Cruise
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scarletspeed7
06/08/17 7:55:26 PM
#189:


It's sitting at 20% on RT right now, so I imagine that Wonder Woman's strong word of mouth will prevent it from dropping all that much, and The Mummy won't even get off the ground. Universal Monsterverse dead on arrival?
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DeathChicken
06/08/17 7:55:31 PM
#190:


And this really had no advertising to speak of either (Mummy ads were everywhere). Amazing what making a goodass movie and letting word of mouth go from there will do
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Bane_Of_Despair
06/08/17 8:22:44 PM
#191:


Woo ya go Wonder Woman
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PrivateBiscuit1
06/08/17 8:24:32 PM
#192:


Every time I'm with my buddies and we see a Mummy trailer, we say to each other "I miss Brenden Frasier." I don't know why they would betray what the originals were like, which were great movies. If you want to make a "Horrorverse" they probably would have been better off starting with a different movie, like Creature from the Black Lagoon, except just call it The Creature and make it an actually quality film. Kickstart it with a surprise that nobody expects.
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SgtSphynx
06/08/17 8:24:57 PM
#193:


The only thing I have heard about The Mummy is that it is "Tom Cruise's worst movie by far"

In contrast, I have heard nothing but praise for Wonder Woman
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redrocket_pub
06/08/17 9:37:13 PM
#194:


SgtSphynx posted...
The only thing I have heard about The Mummy is that it is "Tom Cruise's worst movie by far"


Ouch.
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LeonhartFour
06/08/17 11:45:27 PM
#195:


LapisLazuli posted...
MCU villains as a whole have been....underwhelming. I'd even take the villains in some of the worst DC movies over some of them. Literally Hector Hammond.


Spidey has all the good villains! It couldn't be helped until now!
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MrGreenonion
06/09/17 4:01:38 AM
#196:


PrivateBiscuit1 posted...
Every time I'm with my buddies and we see a Mummy trailer, we say to each other "I miss Brenden Frasier." I don't know why they would betray what the originals were like, which were great movies. If you want to make a "Horrorverse" they probably would have been better off starting with a different movie, like Creature from the Black Lagoon, except just call it The Creature and make it an actually quality film. Kickstart it with a surprise that nobody expects.

They tried to kick it off with Dracula Untold a couple years ago but for whatever reason they decided after the fact to drop it from their new canon.
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Eddv
06/09/17 4:11:30 AM
#197:


LeonhartFour posted...
LapisLazuli posted...
MCU villains as a whole have been....underwhelming. I'd even take the villains in some of the worst DC movies over some of them. Literally Hector Hammond.


Spidey has all the good villains! It couldn't be helped until now!


Even now sony owns most of the good spidey villains.

Theyre going with the vulture gor crissake.
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azuarc
06/09/17 8:29:44 AM
#198:


swordz9 posted...
I didn't even know about the new Mummy until recently and was even more surprised it was starring Tom Cruise

DeathChicken posted...
And this really had no advertising to speak of either (Mummy ads were everywhere). Amazing what making a goodass movie and letting word of mouth go from there will do

I didn't know there was a Mummy movie until this week. By contrast, I've known Wonder Woman's release date for months and have seen YouTube and online ads for it for a while. So I'm a little confused when people say there was no advertising for Wonder Woman.
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MrGreenonion
06/09/17 8:35:42 AM
#199:


Eddv posted...
LeonhartFour posted...
LapisLazuli posted...
MCU villains as a whole have been....underwhelming. I'd even take the villains in some of the worst DC movies over some of them. Literally Hector Hammond.


Spidey has all the good villains! It couldn't be helped until now!


Even now sony owns most of the good spidey villains.

Theyre going with the vulture gor crissake.

Spider-Man Homecoming is a Sony picture. They're using Vulture by choice, because they don't want to redo any villains that were in previous movies. It's not like that's just someone Marvel had the rights to, Sony has the rights to him too.
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PrivateBiscuit1
06/09/17 9:05:20 AM
#200:


See, Vulture is actually an awesome concept and idea for a villain. You can do a lot with that. Unfortunately, his original incarnation sucks and doesn't have a lot of personality or depth beyond just committing crimes.

Michael Keaton's version seems great though because he actually has charisma and a purpose. That's cool and I totally dig a more tech-y Vulture instead of the typical look.
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