Aegis is really overrated. Don't grab it unless your team is already winning.
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Triforce is a luxury item on Support Leona. I grab it if we're dominating and the excessive wards aren't needed.
The best part about Leona is her early game dominance in lane. With a competent carry, we can easily push the enemy out of lane at level 3 because of Leona's double Stun and her Passive that means my carry will be doing more damage than theirs.
I'm really starting to enjoy her dearly.
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TheConductorSix posted... Triforce is a luxury item on Support Leona. I grab it if we're dominating and the excessive wards aren't needed.
The best part about Leona is her early game dominance in lane. With a competent carry, we can easily push the enemy out of lane at level 3 because of Leona's double Stun and her Passive that means my carry will be doing more damage than theirs.
I'm really starting to enjoy her dearly.
This I agree with. Now that the superheal bot metagame is receding slightly leona can shine, because if she lands one combo the enemy team has to back or face death.
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Aegis is for supports and bruisers, not legitimate tanks. Nasus and Taric good. Alistar and Leona bad.
KanzarisKelshen posted... You don't want Glacial Shroud on Leona though. Like sure, it's a great item, but a Randuin's is way better on her for instance because she gets resists naturally, unless you absolutely, positively need dat stun as much as possible. That costs you 3k, which puts you in a large hole compared to TriForce already. Add a cata and you're over the cost. Remember that with W available, Leona wants health.
Why wouldn't you want more stun on Leona when her primary role is to freeze people in place to get their asses beat? And you can't say that you're 1-2k gold in the hole because, guess what, that wasn't my example. Banshee's alone gives her more health, more mana, and magic resistance along with a CC blocker. Those sound like things I'd want on a tank more than...
For 2k, Phage + HoG gets you:
A) 400 health. Good. B) Slow. Good because it means your peel doesn't stop with your abilities. C) Damage. Also good because a tank with no damage is a tank with no threat.
In other words, the first or second Triforce component gives you literally all good stats. The first component also gives you two out of three good stats, and the third component gives you two out of three too. So you have 9 different stats and you make good use of 7. This makes TriForce an excellent purchase. Not rushed all at once mind you, but a quickie phage and maybe sheen are terrific on Leona.
You're making a far bigger deal out of the slow than is necessary. There's a 25% chance of it activating, and if you're wailing on them for long enough for that to bridge the gap between Qs, something's gone horribly wrong. Health without resistances isn't of much use, and I know "leona es the best, #1, best, shield es always win, never loose" but remember, you primary farming tool, which you'll be using A LOT if you're gunning for Triforce in a timely manner, is that same shield. I agree with Realo that Triforce is a luxury item, not what you center your build around. Especially not when you're in a position that requires you to give up farm, something Leona has to do.
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Biolizard28 posted... Aegis is for supports and bruisers, not legitimate tanks. Nasus and Taric good. Alistar and Leona bad.
KanzarisKelshen posted... You don't want Glacial Shroud on Leona though. Like sure, it's a great item, but a Randuin's is way better on her for instance because she gets resists naturally, unless you absolutely, positively need dat stun as much as possible. That costs you 3k, which puts you in a large hole compared to TriForce already. Add a cata and you're over the cost. Remember that with W available, Leona wants health.
Why wouldn't you want more stun on Leona when her primary role is to freeze people in place to get their asses beat? And you can't say that you're 1-2k gold in the hole because, guess what, that wasn't my example. Banshee's alone gives her more health, more mana, and magic resistance along with a CC blocker. Those sound like things I'd want on a tank more than...
For 2k, Phage + HoG gets you:
A) 400 health. Good. B) Slow. Good because it means your peel doesn't stop with your abilities. C) Damage. Also good because a tank with no damage is a tank with no threat.
In other words, the first or second Triforce component gives you literally all good stats. The first component also gives you two out of three good stats, and the third component gives you two out of three too. So you have 9 different stats and you make good use of 7. This makes TriForce an excellent purchase. Not rushed all at once mind you, but a quickie phage and maybe sheen are terrific on Leona.
You're making a far bigger deal out of the slow than is necessary. There's a 25% chance of it activating, and if you're wailing on them for long enough for that to bridge the gap between Qs, something's gone horribly wrong. Health without resistances isn't of much use, and I know "leona es the best, #1, best, shield es always win, never loose" but remember, you primary farming tool, which you'll be using A LOT if you're gunning for Triforce in a timely manner, is that same shield. I agree with Realo that Triforce is a luxury item, not what you center your build around. Especially not when you're in a position that requires you to give up farm, something Leona has to do.
Why are you farming minions and not champions? Leona is up there with Alistar for catching people and crushing them. Hell, she's better because she doesn't have to worry about a pushback.
Also, Banshee's is overkill on Leona, at least early. Given how your initiation mechanism works it takes a REALLY skilled player to counter it, so the need for a spellshield that is going to be popped in the poking phase is minimal. The HP is good of course, but it's a 150 increase over Phage, and the MR is nice but overkill until later. I wouldn't get it until like my third item (where third is "after one or two triforce components and another tank item") unless the team I was facing was super magic heavy.
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The issue with building Leona as primary support instead of tank is that you are an initiator and CCbot. You are meant to jump in and cause havoc and if you melt, then you leave a team CC'd for the first few seconds of battle and then it's a 4v5 if your team doesn't capitalize properly. It also means that you have to send someone who can be a primary tank top, which may not necessarily be beneficial. Double AP is becoming more and more viable in the metagame, so you are limiting yourself to pure tank top instead of tanky dps. I mean, sure someone like Singed is a pure tank but if you can't have Singed then you want Garen, Nasus, and Irelia (or others like them) who are without a doubt not intended to be pure tanks. You're skewing your teamcomp by going more support. You can also support better by staying alive longer. What benefit does Kage's Lucky pick give to your team? Or Wit's End? They have so much less functionality.
If you want to go support then get support items like Aegis or whatever the Lifesteal/AS one is and get Aura items. Wit's end doesn't give CDR to help you CC more, and the AP from Kage's doesn't do anything either. The gold/5 is nice but by that point you can get more than enough assists or kills to make up for it by buying better items and you can get started on your stronger items earlier. Sure she's a fantastic bottom lane, but if you actually build her support then there's an issue there. Just because she's bot lane doesn't mean you have to be relegated to building support, it just means you have to support your AD carry.
Instead of ranting more about Trinity, could you answer why it's a luxury item on support Leona when compared to Pick, Wit's End (not kindlegem because if you're going pure support then obv reverie) or other items?
As Leona I get auraish stuff to help ap people-- abyssal scepter, malady, spellvamp book, unless my team has no AP on it. Oh and yeah a Phage->Frozen Mallet goes in there somewhere.
I have no idea if it's an actual useful build or I'm just that good with her abilities but it seems to work pretty well. People who actually use her for more than free weeks should try it and share results imhhho.
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What do people find is the best way to set up Irelia? Ever since I tried Atmogs it really seems to be working out for me, and suddenly she's become my go-to character for ranked games. I wonder if there's a yet more effective strat that people could suggest though. For the record, my core build goes Warmogs -> Atma's -> Trinity Force.
Luis_Sera89 posted... What do people find is the best way to set up Irelia? Ever since I tried Atmogs it really seems to be working out for me, and suddenly she's become my go-to character for ranked games. I wonder if there's a yet more effective strat that people could suggest though. For the record, my core build goes Warmogs -> Atma's -> Trinity Force.
Atmogs is good on literally everyone. My personal Atmogs style:
Philo HoG Mogs Atma's
This assuming your champion can do stuff without items. The super fast gold gain is excellent for gettings mogs going ASAP.
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Biolizard28 posted... Why are you farming minions and not champions?
Is this a serious question?
Considerinng you have a skill that can make the opponents end up denied because it has about the range of the longer auto ranges...yes. If you're good enough at creep control you can keep the enemy carry at like 15 CS or dead as Leona. Like I said, like Alistar, except better because you don't have to bounce someone against a wall to stop them from getting away.
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From: Lopen | #219 ELO decay? I had no idea. I haven't played ranked in months yet I've been hovering at 1253 forever. How high do you have to be to decay?
above 1400
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Lopen posted... Magic damage dealt is not a very good indicator of teamfight damage because it includes minion damage. Which is probably why Yi owned it so bad.
That being said I'd think brand and even Cho'gath would want to use his abilities to farm enough to win that category over Sona anyway
Who knows.
Well I mean... Brand and Lux were mid, but I outdamaged them both. I'm just a little unclear on how only one person beat me when all I had was Hymn of Valor and the occasional charged autoattack.
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JC quit being such an over reacting sensitive girl. I didn't know it was you on an alt. Bio, wriggles, 5 speed boots, then whatever you prefer between Black Cleaver and Madred. I go with Madreds because it speeds up Baron a ton when you and your clone are health raping him.
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JC quit being such an over reacting sensitive girl. I didn't know it was you on an alt. Bio, wriggles, 5 speed boots, then whatever you prefer between Black Cleaver and Madred. I go with Madreds because it speeds up Baron a ton when you and your clone are health raping him.
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The enemy team is Teemo, Alistar, Talon, Rumble, and Poppy. I think to myself "Okay, Teemo incoming. Gotta be careful about this, at level 6 the entire mid is going to be shroomed and it'll become a massive hassle. What's the best way to handle this..."
So I go mid, and who do I see? Poppy.
Poppy mid.
I have never dominated a lane so hard. She had 9 CS when I had 50. It was hilarious, but that's not even the best part. They eventually realize that Poppy can't do anything to Orianna in mid, so they decide to switch lanes... to Rumble, whom I destroyed only slightly less thoroughly. I couldn't kill him, but I could zone him to a point where he couldn't do anything, and that was just as good.
Seriously though, I'm confused. Maybe the enemy team thought I would go to a side lane and our Annie or our Teemo would go mid, but even then, why send Poppy mid? She's like the worst laner in the game.
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Biolizard28 posted... You need tanky DPS when you have Jax?
Well, if you need MORE than that for some reason, I think Irelia will be on sale soon.
Hm. I wasn't a fan of hers during her free week, but maybe I've gotten better.
I really like Vayne and Ezreal's playstyles, but I already own four AD ranged carries, so they seem... low priority. I like Katarina, but I know she's awful and that Talon is like Katarina 2.0. I've also considered Lux, whom I like, but I already have Orianna. Nidalee is the only champion I enjoy whom I've used before, isn't awful, and whom I don't have someone who can do everything she can do better. I've also been thinking about buying Karma (I'm not loving Sona post-nerf), but she's never on free week to just test out, and I already have Sona for support purposes.
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No WotA and Spirit Visage in its place. Close but no cigar.
EDIT: Or alternatively, Randuin's. You can't have too many Randuins against Trynd and Kong.
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Although I am annoyed that we're getting yet another AD melee DPS champion in a game already loaded with them, Riven is at least confirmed to have a few unique attributes (doesn't use mana, has no "on next hit" Q, has no gap closer), so I'm hoping she'll be fun.
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Gwindor posted... there's too many damn everything I think.
Except pure tanks, obviously.
But every time they release a new champion, all I think is "Great, now there's a chance the champions I like to play will be obsolete."
It's really hard to get excited about new mages for that reason.
I wish they'd make some utility champions, like Teemo. Seems like a missed opportunity there.
There are only four pure supports, five if you count Alistar. Admittedly, there's also a ton of half-supports and partial-supports like Karma, Zilean, Morgana, Lux, and so on. It's also the only type of champion that doesn't have a manaless champion among its ranks other than AD ranged carry.
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