Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 259: Raucous Caucus Robots

(+) Yeah! (+)

LordoftheMorons posted...

I assume he means black X numbers.

i mean, he says "african-american uneployment is the lowest in history by far" and then he says "also, best employment numbers ever." so he's saying "[thing] and also [the same thing]?" it's possible, given how nonsencial trump is in his tweets, but...

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Mr Lasastryke posted...

why are people ignoring the part where he's bragging about "best poverty, youth and unemployment numbers, ever. great!"

huh? he's... still talking about black people there? though admittedly in an awkward way. that's all in the trend of "black lives are better now."

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Donald Trump is a narcissist who makes everything about himself. I seem to recall conservatives getting REALLY upset with Obama when he suggested Trayvon Martin could be his son -- oh the audacity! Nevermind that Obama wasn't even trying to amke Trayvon's death about him -- he made it about the experiences all African Americans face, including himself. But here, Trump is -- as usual -- making everything about him.

I still recall after the Parkland shooting, he had to go out and say that he would've rushed in and stopped the shooter.

It goes to show how unfit he is to be President that he has to have everything about him. His attention span is too limited.

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Wanglicious posted...

still don't really see the problem with trump's tweet. is he hyping himself up a bit there, sure, but the content is about how black people are doing better now - with him in charge - by the numbers. that's fine. spinning that into something else or somehow into a negative thing is just weird.

I think a lot of the general distaste for Trump comes from how he feels this constant need to hype himself up

I agree that this tweet is so low on the Trump scale that its not worth getting into a fuss over, but that also goes to show how much weve become desensitized to the President acting like this
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LordoftheMorons posted...

I assume he means black X numbers. But anyway, the reason it's offensive is that the implication is that black people should on MLK day really be appreciative of Donald Trump, a man who has demonstrated his racism his entire life.

so your issue is "because trump."
that's insane.

you're somehow taking a positive message of "on MLK Day, black lives are better now than they were 3 years ago" and twisting it into a way to be offended. this is one of those trump derangement syndrome situations.

Mr Lasastryke posted...

i mean, he says "african-american uneployment is the lowest in history by far" and then he says "also, best employment numbers ever." so he's saying "[thing] and also [the same thing]?" it's possible, given how nonsencial trump is in his tweets, but...

he split up black youth unemployment from all black unemployment. if you remove the "and" it makes sense.

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Mr Lasastryke posted...

don't like it when people use your bullshit line of attack against you?

Dude alrdy literally agreed with me. Like lol?

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Jakyl25 posted...

I think a lot of the general distaste for Trump comes from how he feels this constant need to hype himself up

I agree that this tweet is so low on the Trump scale that its not worth getting into a fuss over, but that also goes to show how much weve become desensitized to the President acting like this

i mean i get it if you dislike the braggart aspect in it, that makes sense but it's not at all offensive. it's pointing out positive trends in the black community. if this is somehow more than an eyeroll due to the bragging you're going too far.

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Dancedreamer posted...

Donald Trump is a narcissist who makes everything about himself. I seem to recall conservatives getting REALLY upset with Obama when he suggested Trayvon Martin could be his son -- oh the audacity! Nevermind that Obama wasn't even trying to amke Trayvon's death about him -- he made it about the experiences all African Americans face, including himself. But here, Trump is -- as usual -- making everything about him.

I still recall after the Parkland shooting, he had to go out and say that he would've rushed in and stopped the shooter.

It goes to show how unfit he is to be President that he has to have everything about him. His attention span is too limited.

I would hope Obama would raise his child to be less of a criminal than Trayvon, at least!

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Wanglicious posted...

huh? he's... still talking about black people there? though admittedly in an awkward way. that's all in the trend of "black lives are better now."

ok, if multiple people interpreted the tweet that way i'll admit i was wrong. if that's what he meant that's... less bad than what i thought he said, but still bad. the reason martin luther king is legendary is because he did a lot to combat racism against black people. the fact that trump is going "LOOK AT HOW MUCH JOBS BLACK PEOPLE HAVE" is... tangentially related to king's legacy at best.

also, as LotM and peace_frog pointed out, it's rather perverse that trump is praising MLK when he himself has a long history of saying shit that's racist as fuck. that's an aspect i didn't even consider initially but yeah, that makes it even worse.

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Corrik7 posted...

I would hope Obama would raise his child to be less of a criminal than Trayvon, at least!

Well Trayvon was less of a criminal than you!

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Dancedreamer posted...

Well Trayvon was less of a criminal than you!

I suppose in ways he was.

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Corrik7 posted...

Dude alrdy literally agreed with me. Like lol?

what are you talking about? who agreed with you that "no matter what trump does, 'you all' will always complain about him"? because that's the "bullshit line of attack" i was talking about.

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Corrik, Dancedreamer, theres no fighting in the war room
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Corrik7 posted...

If Trump sat there and monologued for 24 hours straight for all of MLK day about how great MLK was, you would still call him a racist and just say he is trying to woo African-American voters or not properly giving MLK his due. I mean, we can be honest with ourselves. No matter what he does, you are going to complain.

Peace___Frog posted...

You're right. One action wouldn't undo decades of targeted harassment and illegal practices. If he made an ongoing effort to undo the damage his past actions directly caused, then I'd happily call him not a racist.

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Wanglicious posted...

i mean i get it if you dislike the braggart aspect in it, that makes sense but it's not at all offensive. it's pointing out positive trends in the black community. if this is somehow more than an eyeroll due to the bragging you're going too far.

The underlying issue causing him to say things like this actually matters a ton. He probably couldnt get away with this with black people, but Trump not feeling like he got sufficient appreciation for his administrations botched response to Hurricane Maria in Puerto Rico has caused him to prevent Congress from allocating more money to help rebuild the island (iirc he literally threatened to veto a budget over it). Trumps narcissism is currently one of the biggest threats to our country.

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LordoftheMorons posted...

The underlying issue causing him to say things like this actually matters a ton. He probably couldnt get away with this with black people, but Trump not feeling like he got sufficient appreciation for his administrations botched response to Hurricane Maria in Puerto Rico has caused him to prevent Congress from allocating more money to help rebuild the island (iirc he literally threatened to veto a budget over it). Trumps narcissism is currently one of the biggest threats to our country.

And it turns out Trump was right that inept people on the island kept supplies from people that we sent them to help them. Probably even some of the same people who criticized Trump for not helping enough.

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the thing i took issue with was the "no matter what he does, you are going to complain" part.

admittedly, that's on me for not specifying it (though i thought it was clear because i was referring to dancedreamer's post).

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Wanglicious posted...

so your issue is "because trump."
that's insane.

you're somehow taking a positive message of "on MLK Day, black lives are better now than they were 3 years ago" and twisting it into a way to be offended. this is one of those trump derangement syndrome situations.

No, you're the one who's twisting this to be a message that isn't about Trump. If he was actually talking about how much black lives have improved, he would have said they're better than they were 50 years ago. Instead, he said 3, which is making it about himself.

Corrik7 posted...

And it turns out Trump was right that inept people on the island kept supplies from people that we sent them to help them. Probably even some of the same people who criticized Trump for not helping enough.

So your proposed solution is to fuck over everyone else on the island?

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Corrik7 posted...

And it turns out Trump was right that inept people on the island kept supplies from people that we sent them to help them. Probably even some of the same people who criticized Trump for not helping enough.

You realize both could be true, right? It can be possible that the Puerto Rican organizers were incompetent or malicious AND that we on the mainland could have provided more aid
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LordoftheMorons posted...

So your proposed solution is to fuck over everyone else on the island?

Show me where I said that? Though, I do think we should be more hesitant to send things if the things we send are not actually getting to the people.

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https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/20/politics/senate-organizing-resolution-released/index.html

Impeachment Speedrun
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his narcissism is also what had him de-escalate in Iran the way he did and his double take on attacking Syria. he wants to be liked. there's good and bad things to dealing with someone like that.

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Corrik7 posted...

Show me where I said that? Though, I do think we should be more hesitant to send things if the things we send are not actually getting to the people.

If youre the federal government and you now know that is happening, shouldnt you take control of the issue instead of just letting the supplies fester? Its part of America, Trump has jurisdiction there.
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Corrik7 posted...

Show me where I said that? Though, I do think we should be more hesitant to send things if the things we send are not actually getting to the people.

Well, you made that statement in defense of Trump refusing to send more aid to the island so thats the logical conclusion

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any% major glitches impeachment

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Paratroopa1 posted...

No, you're the one who's twisting this to be a message that isn't about Trump. If he was actually talking about how much black lives have improved, he would have said they're better than they were 50 years ago. Instead, he said 3, which is making it about himself.

no, the message is literally about black people's lives improving.
yes, he's talking himself up in there... with the message being that black lives are better now than they were. there's no twist to that.

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Wanglicious posted...

his narcissism is also what had him de-escalate in Iran the way he did and his double take on attacking Syria. he wants to be liked. there's good and bad things to dealing with someone like that.

A problem he created! Sorry, I don't usually give credit to people who start fires and then don't add gasoline to them.

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Jakyl25 posted...

You realize both could be true, right? It can be possible that the Puerto Rican organizers were incompetent or malicious AND that we on the mainland could have provided more aid

Unable to be discerned when the things we sent weren't even given to the people. How do we know how much they even received at this point? Three times now I think in the past months we have found caches now. How much was illegally sold or diverted? How much remains at large? Now you have to distrust everything regarding it and be more cautious in things. By assuming everyone was on the page of getting help to people, people suffered. Is that the party who gave's fault or the party who was supposed to make sure people got it? I can't see crying that people didn't give enough gifts for toys for tots when gifts were given and the people who collected them didn't give them all out.

At what point can we assess that enough gifts did not come in for every child to have one? It's impossible now to figure out because ineptitude and/or corruption happened which ruined the process.

For all we know, we sent three times more than everyone needed. Or we didn't send enough. Impossible to assess due to what happened there.

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Wanglicious posted...

no, the message is literally about black people's lives improving.
yes, he's talking himself up in there... with the message being that black lives are better now than they were. there's no twist to that.

I think other people are making the inference that hes using it to say black people should be grateful to him, and I dont think you are making that inference.
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Corrik7 posted...

For all we know, we sent three times more than everyone needed. Or we didn't send enough. Impossible to assess due to what happened there.

Impossible for US IN THIS TOPIC to assess, but it really shouldnt be impossible for the US GOVERNMENT to assess
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Speaking of corruption with the Puerto Rico relief effort, remember this?

https://www.thedailybeast.com/tiny-montana-firm-wins-dollar300m-puerto-rico-electricity-contract

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more that i don't see that part really matter since the good thing is that there's improvement. if he wants to take credit for it, fine, whatever. life is better - that's all that matters. which, on MLK, sure seems to be the main point.

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Jakyl25 posted...

I think other people are making the inference that hes using it to say black people should be grateful to him, and I dont think you are making that inference.

Or he is saying that they should be proud of his presidency and the positive direction it has had upon their community. It doesn't really matter what his intention was. He didn't say fuck MLK this should be Donald Trump day because I have done more for you. He honored MLK via the white house Twitter, visited his memorial. And, in his own way tried to state he was trying to do good for African Americans. Okay. Not really some issue.

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Dancedreamer posted...

A problem he created! Sorry, I don't usually give credit to people who start fires and then don't add gasoline to them.

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Jakyl25 posted...

Impossible for US IN THIS TOPIC to assess, but it really shouldnt be impossible for the US GOVERNMENT to assess

Cuz they know everything that wasn't given out and such. If anything, maybe Trump's headscratching going "We helped them out tremendously I don't know why they are saying we didn't do enough for them cuz they are brown people is being said" makes a little more sense now.

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deescalating Iran are you fucking kidding me

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Wanglicious posted...

more that i don't see that part really matter since the good thing is that there's improvement. if he wants to take credit for it, fine, whatever. life is better - that's all that matters. which, on MLK, sure seems to be the main point.

I feel like theres danger in handwaving away the President saying his constituents should be grateful for what hes done for them, if thats what one believes he is saying.
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Wanglicious posted...

but the content is about how black people are doing better now - with him in charge - by the numbers. that's fine.

Corrik7 posted...

you would still call him a racist and just say he is trying to woo African-American voters

Well, let's ask them what they think then.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/black-americans-deeply-pessimistic-about-country-
under-president-who-more-than-8-in-10-describe-as-a-racist-post-ipsos-poll-finds/2020/01/16/
134b705c-37de-11ea-bb7b-265f4554af6d_story.html

Not as good a link, but I know some have complained about WaPo's paywall at times: https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/17/politics/black-voters-trump-poll/index.html

WaPo/Ipsos poll of black Americans:

• 83% say that they believe Trump is a racist
• 83% say that he has made racism a bigger problem in the country
• 90% Disapproval of Trump (75% Strongly disapprove. 7% approve)
• 76% say that the things Trump is doing as president have been bad for African Americans (4% say they have been good)
• 65% say it is "a bad time to be a black person in America" (30% say good)

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Corrik7 posted...

Cuz they know everything that wasn't given out and such

I mean, shouldnt they?
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xp1337 posted...

65% say it is "a bad time to be a black person in America" (30% say good)

Would love to see the trend line on that one
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Wanglicious posted...

more that i don't see that part really matter since the good thing is that there's improvement. if he wants to take credit for it, fine, whatever. life is better - that's all that matters. which, on MLK, sure seems to be the main point.

I just do not think you are seeing in between the lines here. The primary statement being made is "I am an awesome president and you should be grateful for me," and his motivation behind this statement is that he has a huge ego and he gets antsy whenever people aren't lavishing praise upon him. It has literally nothing to do with black welfare and if you don't see that then you've just being misreading the guy for years. (Yes, all politicians do try to score points in this way but most would invoke the entire country when doing so; hence me saying "50 years" vs "3 years" which is obviously a petty statement about himself and a slight against his predecessor)

Also it's highly questionable whether or not black lives have improved in the last three years, I would probably say "about the same" at best, it's more likely than not a scarier time to be black

xp1337 posted...

Well, let's ask them what they think then.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/black-americans-deeply-pessimistic-about-country-
under-president-who-more-than-8-in-10-describe-as-a-racist-post-ipsos-poll-finds/2020/01/16/
134b705c-37de-11ea-bb7b-265f4554af6d_story.html

Not as good a link, but I know some have complained about WaPo's paywall at times: https://www.cnn.com/2020/01/17/politics/black-voters-trump-poll/index.html

WaPo/Ipsos poll of black Americans:

* 83% say that they believe Trump is a racist
* 83% say that he has made racism a bigger problem in the country
* 90% Disapproval of Trump (75% Strongly disapprove. 7% approve)
* 76% say that the things Trump is doing as president have been bad for African Americans (4% say they have been good)
* 65% say it is "a bad time to be a black person in America" (30% say good)

Polarized America is fun.

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I think life in America for anyone who isn't white has unequivocally gotten worse within the last 3 years, and I'd need to see some real hard evidence to convince me otherwise.

(Also, life has gotten worse for white people too, it's just gotten worse for non-white people)

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So their criticism relating to their own lives and situations can be downplayed by "polarized America" but your commentary is objective and not subject to the same thing you are claiming?

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KamikazePotato posted...

I think life in America for anyone who isn't white has unequivocally gotten worse within the last 3 years, and I'd need to see some real hard evidence to convince me otherwise.

(Also, life has gotten worse for white people too, it's just gotten worse for non-white people)

Um ok. First off, why don't you list how your life has gotten worse in the last 3 years, and we can start there.

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xp1337 posted...

So their criticism about their own lives and situations can be downplayed by "polarized America" but your commentary is objective and not subject to the same thing you are claiming?

I mean, when your breakdowns on things like impeachment, removal, racism break down almost exactly by the voting lines in the previous election, what are you supposed to say really? Not saying they are wrong, but I wonder what that poll would say if literally nothing at all changed besides Obama was President and not Trump in that poll. I wonder.

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KamikazePotato posted...

I think life in America for anyone who isn't white has unequivocally gotten worse within the last 3 years, and I'd need to see some real hard evidence to convince me otherwise.

(Also, life has gotten worse for white people too, it's just gotten worse for non-white people)

You can't be serious

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Paratroopa1 posted...

It has literally nothing to do with black welfare and if you don't see that then you've just being misreading the guy for years.

you're saying that a subject about black welfare isn't about black welfare because trump said it/is being a braggart about it.

don't know where to go from there, the argument is literally "because trump." you're removing the positivity of the message and saying it does not matter because trump. there's no argument to be had after that.

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Anybody who claims Donald "Deescalated" Iran can fuck right off