Board 8 > Star Trek Mafia - Topic 7: I am not a merry man.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Yeah I'm sorry, I read that wrong

It's late here lol. But I'm up for a bit.

##vote: Ulti

UltimaterializerX posted...

I need some logic on why Justin is town.

Though I have two ideas for much better lynches than him anyway.

Got a bit of a headache. Would you like the little writeup I had, last night?

"First things first: personal vendetta be damned, do NOT let Crescent hide behind a veil of inactivity. She only voted once at the end of day 1 (even if BCT was the hammerer) and has otherwise just been loud and annoying - and she has ABSOLUTELY won a game of Mafia against rookies as scum by doing that before. With the amount of dead vanillas, I call BS on a Miller claim at this point, too, especially if she got caught moving day 2, and it is 100% in her wheelhouse to go "I didn't do it, BCT sealed the deal" no matter what alignment BCT winds up.

Second: I'm putting this down right now. The rookie card has expired, there's been some disconnect on posts as though he were ignoring people he knew were town completely, and you know who does that? People listening to Chris in the dead chat. Wallmasterz is coasting on newbie points.

Third: I'm well aware of how bad that flip looked on Sheep. If he was scum, you'd be "bussing Isquen?!" anyways - I KNOW I'm an easy mislynch to the point of lunacy of someone claiming I could be a Ninja Bulletproof Godfather (and I wish I was kidding that such a claim has been levered at me before.) For what it's worth, I'm taking Sheep's end of day posts to heart: it might be a mountain to climb with a weather of words being placed into one's mouth against one's will, but we need to talk about the oddly sedate Han this game.

These are by no means my only suspicions, but I'd rather keep my town reads to myself at this point from the unmentioned - and please take a VERY close look at the people who vote me for my very likely mislynch.

Willing to same-time claim at some point if someone else is at this point."

And Crescent's now dead. It would be way, way too easy for me to do dance on her grave if I were, you know, capable of movement.

so in a game of 14 i'm not inclined to believe town has both a doctor and a bus driver - that's two hard protection. scum bus driver would make sense given that neither me or Ulti was RB'd and they clearly didn't RB Crescent.

so if we believe ulti, then scum bus driver. scum bussing BCT to Ulti makes sense regardless of BCT's alignment because BCT was the somewhat obvious scan.

if we think town bus driver, then the BD also kind of makes sense because BCT was the lowest-value claim to swap.

but what doesn't make sense is, if scum has a bus driver, why they would need to use an unblockable kill on crescent. they could just use the bus drive to kill their intended target if they're assuming ulti protects crescent. especially when Ulti has claimed BP. so scum must either not believe that Ulti is BP, or they wanted to protect BCT from my scan so badly that they used their unblockable in a sub-optimal way by piercing protection on Crescent.

so i'm inclined to say BCT has to be scum otherwise they would have used the bus on crescent, but i'm also extremely cautious that Chris has carefully laid this exact trail of breadcrumbs, having successfully predicted the scan on town BCT.

Needless to say, Sheep flipping town surprised me.

Isquen, Dumey, and JC is where I'm at. Isquen's vote on the uncountered doctor claim looks legitimately awful. JC looks really bad for scanning me and thinking that I'm going to buy that someone switched me with Ulti. Scum wasn't going to kill me after I admitted my softclaim was a distraction, so what benefit would it have to direct anyone going for me to Ulti? Sounds like a fake claim at this point.

I'm fine lynching any of those three.

Chaeix posted...

scum bus driver. scum bussing BCT to Ulti makes sense regardless of BCT's alignment because BCT was the somewhat obvious scan.

Why was I the obvious scan for a tracker? I'm vanilla. I faked a softclaim and admitted it.

For a cop, sure, I get that. A cop would absolutely want to scan me after D2. But it sounds to me like you're trying to push my mislynch using logic you yourself set up, JC.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

Scum wasn't going to kill me after I admitted my softclaim was a distraction, so what benefit would it have to direct anyone going for me to Ulti?

weren't you one of the people saying i should have scanned a vanilla yesterday

and now you're wondering what benefit there would be for me to scan a vanilla

and you do realize if i were scum, i could have also just come in and said 'i scanned bct, he went nowhere'

bct you do realize i was harangued endlessly by people yesterday for not scanning a vanilla claim right

Happy d3 everyone and RIP Crescent.

Just a heads up Im very sleep deprived (thanks 11 month old Wall Jr) so I wont be posting much tonight. I read d1 today and plan to re-read d2, it seems obvious in hindsight she got a guilty read on someone she was very in favor of lynching yesterday.

isquen im honored to be in your PoE along with uncountered doc claim ulti

BlueCrystalTear posted...

Why was I the obvious scan for a tracker? I'm vanilla. I faked a softclaim and admitted it.

For a cop, sure, I get that. A cop would absolutely want to scan me after D2. But it sounds to me like you're trying to push my mislynch using logic you yourself set up, JC.

also i'm not pushing for your lynch yet, i was just establishing the possibilities of what might have happened. i am very open to the possibility that this is all a setup, especially if scum doesn't believe that Ulti is BP. they wouldn't feel the need to save their unblockable kill just for him.

Is it possible that i's just the group of BCT/Isquen/Wallz?

BCT rule of three's Isquen with me and JC in the first post of this day, and completely ignores to mention anything about Wallz who they had interactions with earlier in the game.

Isquen goes after uncountered doctor Ulti.

Wallz vote looks the worst on the Sheep lynch when we take into account that in retrospect scum was happy to let Sheep get lynched and that was the reason no scum tried to move the lynch a different direction.

Wallz, if I can ask you a question, can you tell summarize why Sheep was thought to be scum yesterday in general and why you voted them?

Honestly last night, I was wondering if claimed Miller Crescent might be an insulated scum hiding in people's good graces. Her vote on Chris was in the last 20 seconds of the day, so I was thinking the interactions with Sheep maybe made her scum. That was an angle I wanted to look at today, but now I don't have that. The "insulated scum" at this point would have to be Han or Lea at this point, or a lying Ulti, but I really don't believe that at this time. All three of them have too much pointing them in a townie direction.

I do have JC in my PoE as well, but I'm trying to digest the night action info that's been claimed so far. Confirming the existence of a bus driver would be a creative use of a fake claim motion detector. If there is a scum motive there for a lying JC to try and claim that the existence of a bus driver means Ulti is scum? But that doesn't make sense with a scum bus driver, so I'm leaning toward JC being truthful for the moment.

EDumey posted...

All three of them have too much pointing them in a townie direction.

Can you elaborate a bit more on Han specifically?

I was reading Sheep's EoD posts and he correctly points out that Han's reads haven't been great this game with the exception of voting correctly on Chris (in the last 10mins of the day) and with the Sheep flip it may be worth re-evaluating.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

Why was I the obvious scan for a tracker? I'm vanilla. I faked a softclaim and admitted it.

For a cop, sure, I get that. A cop would absolutely want to scan me after D2. But it sounds to me like you're trying to push my mislynch using logic you yourself set up, JC.

I mean I'd not complain if I was town JC if town was trying to clear you.

This is super sus

Chaeix posted...

bct you do realize i was harangued endlessly by people yesterday for not scanning a vanilla claim right

Why me, though? I'm obvious town at this point. And you didn't listen to what people were saying about that.

EDumey posted...

Is it possible that i's just the group of BCT/Isquen/Wallz?

No, it isn't.

May I ask why you thought I should mention Wallz? That feels like yet another major stretch.

##vote: Dumey

Like BCT if I was you claiming town vanilla and JC a tracker and tou go no where you're cleared town... so why would town BCT be mad about this?

##Vote:BCT

this looks like a scum slip

BlueCrystalTear posted...

Why me, though? I'm obvious town at this point. And you didn't listen to what people were saying about that.

because you were the only claimed vanilla

it's actually that simple

or at least the only claimed vanilla according to sultan's list on page 1 of this topic because i was too lazy to look far and didn't remember anyone else claiming vanilla

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

I mean I'd not complain if I was town JC if town was trying to clear you.

This is super sus

How so? I'm not complaining that he chose me so much as questing why. He could have put in a track for somebody more suspicious than me. Such as Dumey or Isquen.

I feel like scum is setting me up for a mislynch and I'm having none of it.

Chaeix posted...

because you were the only claimed vanilla

it's actually that simple

No, I'm not actually.

This is a scum slip. JC is scum with Dumey, guys!

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

Like BCT if I was you claiming town vanilla and JC a tracker and tou go no where you're cleared town... so why would town BCT be mad about this?

##Vote:BCT

this looks like a scum slip

What the fuck? This is a massive stretch. Are you scum, too?

so BCT i want you to answer this as a yes or no question

after being called dumb by a bunch of people for not scanning a claimed vanilla, would you, in my shoes, scan someone other than the claimed vanilla?

BlueCrystalTear posted...

No, I'm not actually.

This is a scum slip. JC is scum with Dumey, guys!

who else is?

##unvote

I thought I had deleted that Ulti vote when I posted.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

What the fuck? This is a massive stretch. Are you scum, too?

Like you're mad you got scanned to get cleared youre on alot of peoples POE list its a great scan as town tbh.

The fact he got ulti is weird and makes me think less that JC is town but your reaction is all kinds of backwards and looks super suspicious

Okay, maybe it's not Isquen but Sultan? That right there makes me think I fell into a trap sheet Sheep flips town and scum pushes me hard.

Whose flip tells us the most? That isn't me, because I'm very town, and this is getting frustrating. My PM literally says nobody listens to me. Curse you, RNG gods!

Chaeix posted...

after being called dumb by a bunch of people for not scanning a claimed vanilla, would you, in my shoes, scan someone other than the claimed vanilla?

No.

But there was more than one claimed vanilla.

Okay, maybe it's Dumey, Isquen, Sultan.

Yeah, that sounds right.

Chaeix posted...

Can you elaborate a bit more on Han specifically?

I was reading Sheep's EoD posts and he correctly points out that Han's reads haven't been great this game with the exception of voting correctly on Chris (in the last 10mins of the day) and with the Sheep flip it may be worth re-evaluating.

The vote on Chris is definitely the most important part, as Han was the one that actually broke the tie on Chris two minutes before end of day, when the lynch could have gone any direction. It would have been MUCH safer to lynch Death, and I'm fairly certain from my recent game with Han that he does not like bussing unless necessary.
He also had a couple of back and forth arguments with Chris both very early in literal Topic 1, as well as later when Chris was poking at him for reaction. Could be scum theater?
I also don't know if it's right to categorize Han's reads as bad. They weren't correct, but not necessarily scummy. Important to make that distinction. I didn't agree with his read on your list post JC, but he did have a genuine argument on it that I understood. His argument on Sheep didn't turn out to be correct, but I don't think it was a scummy argument. There's a difference.
If you told me there HAD to be a scum in Han/Lea/Ulti, I would say Han is the most likely given no doctor counterclaim on Ulti.

BCT question what is wrong with scanning a Non claimed at this point and answer this carefully

BlueCrystalTear posted...

No.

But there was more than one claimed vanilla.

who was it

you're getting annoyed with me but you also clearly don't know who else?

EDumey posted...

The vote on Chris is definitely the most important part, as Han was the one that actually broke the tie on Chris two minutes before end of day, when the lynch could have gone any direction. It would have been MUCH safer to lynch Death, and I'm fairly certain from my recent game with Han that he does not like bussing unless necessary.
He also had a couple of back and forth arguments with Chris both very early in literal Topic 1, as well as later when Chris was poking at him for reaction. Could be scum theater?
I also don't know if it's right to categorize Han's reads as bad. They weren't correct, but not necessarily scummy. Important to make that distinction. I didn't agree with his read on your list post JC, but he did have a genuine argument on it that I understood. His argument on Sheep didn't turn out to be correct, but I don't think it was a scummy argument. There's a difference.
If you told me there HAD to be a scum in Han/Lea/Ulti, I would say Han is the most likely given no doctor counterclaim on Ulti.

this is all fair, thank you for indulging me, actually a great reply

BCT can you engage in anything other than OMGUS? Literally anything. Give one single reason other than "thinks I'm scum." You gave an annoying take right at end of day that I didn't get a chance to respond to because Wallz hammered the lynch. You still think I only suspect you for one reason, when I gave FIVE reasons back to Crescent back in Topic 6. I told you in good faith that I'd drop one of them, but that still leaves FOUR other reasons to suspect you when you're stock in the middle of the PoE.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

May I ask why you thought I should mention Wallz? That feels like yet another major stretch.

You didn't like Wallz earlier in the game, but now you're completely okay with Wallz to the point that they're not even in your PoE? How did that happen?

Chaeix posted...

who was it

you're getting annoyed with me but you also clearly don't know who else?

Dumey. I thought I said that. Maybe my phone deleted it, whoops.

TheSultanOfSlam posted...

BCT question what is wrong with scanning a Non claimed at this point and answer this carefully

Because you can tip off scum to unclaimed powers. That's really it. With vanillagers, you can check if they're lying.

EDumey posted...

Give one single reason other than "thinks I'm scum."

Just curious: Can you not read?

dumey are you in fact also a claimed vanilla as BCT says

EDumey posted...

You didn't like Wallz earlier in the game, but now you're completely okay with Wallz to the point that they're not even in your PoE? How did that happen?

More like he's nowhere near as suspicious as several others, but especially you. Can you do something actually useful, or are you just going to go after me with absolutely zero logic?

Chaeix posted...

dumey are you in fact also a claimed vanilla as BCT says

No. I have specifically soft claimed that I have a role, and have not claimed anything specific. BCT is referencing Han assuming I am Vanilla, but I have not claimed.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

TheSultanOfSlam posted...
BCT question what is wrong with scanning a Non claimed at this point and answer this carefully
Because you can tip off scum to unclaimed powers. That's really it. With vanillagers, you can check if they're lying.

Great so you see why your reaction is super suspicious. Jc Scanning a Non claimed outs town power.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

Just curious: Can you not read?

Just curious, can you? You claimed I only suspected you for one reason, and that was a lie. And when I look through your posts, all I see is you throwing suspicion back at people suspecting you, claiming "I am obvious Town" while you clearly don't understand Process of Elimination, and that you are on nearly every single person's PoE right now.

Let me ask you this question in good faith, instead of you trying to snark at me. What reason do you have for not having Wallz in your PoE list?

EDumey posted...

No. I have specifically soft claimed that I have a role, and have not claimed anything specific. BCT is referencing Han assuming I am Vanilla, but I have not claimed.

Then why don't you claim? I thought you claimed day 1, though after Sheep. You are most assuredly scum, though, since Sheep wasn't.

Maybe I'm just dumb and getting my facts confused. Apologies.

Also, looking and pics of cats is... calming. Meow.

If others want me to claim, then I probably wouldn't be averse to doing so today now that our protection and investigation roles are already outed. But I'm certainly not going to do it just for you.

Respond to my question about Wallz. You specifically quoted my post but ignored the question directly posed to you. Don't wait for a response from your scum board.

EDumey posted...

No. I have specifically soft claimed that I have a role, and have not claimed anything specific. BCT is referencing Han assuming I am Vanilla, but I have not claimed.

serious question does scum BCT insist so hard he's the wrong target specifically because he misunderstands how many vanilla claims there are

if he's scum and the plan was to protect him, he'd be aware that he was the only logical scan and why he would be bussed and scanned. he would know he was the only vanilla claim.

EDumey posted...

Just curious, can you?

Yes. I note that you didn't answer my question, so I'm taking that as an admission of guilt.

You are going after me and have yet to offer any reason that isn't OMGUS. So you're one to talk.

My vote for you stands and isn't changing all day.

I can worry about Wallz later. I have clear scum to fry and I'm starting with you. You are trying to push as many mislynches as possible and I'm seeing right through it.

Chaeix posted...

serious question does scum BCT insist so hard he's the wrong target specifically because he misunderstands how many vanilla claims there are

if he's scum and the plan was to protect him, he'd be aware that he was the only logical scan and why he would be bussed and scanned. he would know he was the only vanilla claim.

I mean there's no reason he should be mad about you confirming his lack of movement in the first place. So I don't think him not understanding how many Vanilla claims there were is telling. With Han insisting that I was Vanilla, he could easily be remembering conversation from a scum board about me not being a target because I'm vanilla, than actually remembering my claim or lack thereof.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

Yes. I note that you didn't answer my question, so I'm taking that as an admission of guilt.

You are going after me and have yet to offer any reason that isn't OMGUS. So you're one to talk.

My vote for you stands and isn't changing all day.

I can worry about Wallz later. I have clear scum to fry and I'm starting with you. You are trying to push as many mislynches as possible and I'm seeing right through it.

Here's my post where I listed FIVE reasons for thinking you lean scum BCT. 6.344.
EDumey posted...

Start of game self-consciousness.
Has only very sparsely engaged in the game, and almost 90% only in response to their own name being brought up.
Ulti hard scummoned them at the end of the day and they made references back to when I had talked about them half a day previously, as if they had it in their notes but hadn't bothered actually posting yet. Looks like active lurking to me.
Makes justification about not being a good scan target, then self reports shortly after that the last time they were defensive about being scanned, it was because they were scum.

I also have one more thing but I feel like I should go find the specific post to quote for proof. Their original answer to my Chris question was pure Chris-fear and admitting to not engaging with Chris at all. Then later on they made a "Correction" post with a more measured answer, that felt like they were trying to fix their previous bad post. I wondered at that time if someone on scum board told them it was a bad answer, and they felt like they had to fix it. But I will admit that one is just a crackpot theory, and not actually naturally scummy.

The ONLY thing they have in their favor is voting Chris at the very last second, even though their vote wasn't actually impactful, but I guess it could have been if there were other last second votes. Ulti seems willing to completely town clear everyone on the Chris lynch, but if scum said it was okay to bus Chris there at the end, then if ANY of the votes on that lynch are suspect, it's that very last second addition from BCT. I'm not willing to completely remove them from suspicion just based on that vote.

I have reasons for you being scum, do you have reasons for me other than OMGUS? You haven't stated any yet.

Also I can add "Refused to respond about Wallz because they needed to wait for a good answer from his scum board" to the list. There's NO reason not to respond now as town. There is zero town equity in refusing to answer the question.

EDumey posted...

I mean there's no reason he should be mad about you confirming his lack of movement in the first place. So I don't think him not understanding how many Vanilla claims there were is telling.

But it's connected. His frustration about me targeting him makes more sense if it's "why the f didn't you target dumey" as opposed to "why did you scan the vanilla".

It was remarkably unclear initially that's what he was getting at, but I think it became clear eventually.

BCT, given that I'm telling the truth and if I flip you'll be confronted with the fact I was BD'd, how would the existence of a bus driver impact your thoughts on the game?

Guys, Dumey is 100% scum.

Not only is it a soul read, he's admitting he can't read my posts. I'm literally explaining how you are scum. Please learn to read before ever speaking to me again, thanks.

Chaeix posted...

BCT, given that I'm telling the truth and if I flip you'll be confronted with the fact I was BD'd, how would the existence of a bus driver impact your thoughts on the game?

It's a scum bus driver. Clearly.

I'm willing to bet it's Dumey. Given all his OMGUS BS, it makes perfect sense.

BCT continues to avoid the question that he should be able to easily respond to. His only reason for voting me is because I'm "leading a mislynch" on him, and somehow doesn't understand that this is a pure OMGUS reason.

BlueCrystalTear posted...

I'm literally explaining how you are scum.

you straight up are not. you are saying 'i'm literally explaining how you are scum' while literally not explaining how he is scum.

he is asking you reasonable questions and you're OMGUSing him

don't be under any illusion that you're the one who looks good in this exchange