Board 8 > Ace Attorney Topic Part 4: The Happening (Spoilers for AA1-6, AAI1-2)

(+) Yeah! (+)

E1-2 Beginning complete

I've never liked Cammy Meele's design because it doesn't feel like it "fits" with the Ace Attorney design style. It's out of place in the same way Mike Meekins's design is.

speaking of which he's in the next case isn't he augh
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I totally see what you mean about Mike Meekins' design but I never felt that way about Cammy, I dunno.
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It's mostly the eyes (they're practically all iris with no white) and the teeth (or rather the fact that she doesn't have discernible teeth but it's all one large white thing).
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I wonder if Edgeworth can catch Phoenix in line count before Phoenix leaves him in the dust for good with the last three games. The fact that AAI2 is so absurdly long at least gives him a puncher's chance, I think.
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Okay, I text dumped all the line count info into a Google Doc. It doesn't have any special formatting or anything since I'm no good at that sort of thing, but for the purposes of this project, it'll do.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1sBPDmATQERIv7R3VvvXx43DRJZNOwnSwmLkZhfWLqSc/edit?usp=sharing

I'll still post case/game-specific stuff in here whenever I finish a case/game, but I won't be dumping the entire thing every time anymore, so if you want to take a look at all that stuff, it'll be in there.

I also dumped all my time stuff onto another Google Doc. I know people occasionally ask me about stuff from that from time to time, so if you're ever curious about something, you can find it for yourself now!

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1qSdmjcbQjG_QPBFylHNgk7oVXRbsSjDetdO8w7Ygh8k/edit?usp=sharing

I also dumped all my old writeups from two years ago onto a Google Doc, but that's more just for my own personal satisfaction so I don't ever lose it. I doubt anyone here would actually want to read those things again.
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we need a new game so we can update those lists. I can't speak for Leonhart but mine change pretty drastically when I go back through the series. he's done it so many times that it's probably pretty set in stone.
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transcience posted...

we need a new game so we can update those lists. I can't speak for Leonhart but mine change pretty drastically when I go back through the series. he's done it so many times that it's probably pretty set in stone.

There's always a character or two I seem to like more after a replay, like Ini and Marshall have both climbed up in my estimation over the years. There's still some room for fluctuation with the newer games simply because I'm not as intimately familiar with them yet.

Characters usually only go up for me though. It's pretty rare for one to take a dive.
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Also, my list beyond like the top 15 or so probably wouldn't stay exactly the same if I were to remake the list right now. That's part of the reason I made tiers just to give a general idea of where they fit. They might move around within that tier, but that's the range they abide in.
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i don't know that i've ever even gone beyond 15-20 in a character ranking
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You should! It's a fun exercise as long as you don't feel like your rankings have to be exact or have some sort of formula to them or something. At least that's how it is for me. I just get a list of all the characters together and then sorta eyeball the rankings as I go.
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These cross-examinations with Franziska feel like such a waste of time because Edgeworth already proved at the beginning that he didn't do it, and all you're doing is just repeating the facts here. Does Franziska honestly think Edgeworth could have done it, or is she just trolling him? In the first scenario, it would represent a startling lack of character growth, and in the second scenario, she's just wasting my time. Not sure which one is better!
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Rhoda says she buys a suitcase every flight she works, but each suitcase costs $1200

do stewardesses make a lot more than I realized or is she just bankrupting herself to massage her ego
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E1-2 Middle complete

nice and breezy and featuring a random Sal Manella cameo

it's also one of those rare segments where every important character in the case has lines
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LeonhartFour posted...

These cross-examinations with Franziska feel like such a waste of time because Edgeworth already proved at the beginning that he didn't do it, and all you're doing is just repeating the facts here. Does Franziska honestly think Edgeworth could have done it, or is she just trolling him? In the first scenario, it would represent a startling lack of character growth, and in the second scenario, she's just wasting my time. Not sure which one is better!

She obviously doesn't think he did it. I always read that sequence as a bit of a mental sparring match which fits the sibling relationship the two have: "let's see how clever you are, Miles: prove to me it couldn't have been you".

I mean I can see why you'd read that as time-wasting but I enjoy it because those are two of my favourite characters and watching them bounce off each other is fun.
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eh the problem is that Franziska never drops the tough girl facade so even if she is just trolling it doesn't look any different than if she wasn't
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I dunno if I'd call it trolling but you can label it that if you want? Regardless, she's not serious about her accusation and if she were serious it would look quite different. She's pretty obviously in good humour during 5-2. If she actually thought one of the few people she gave a **** about was the smuggler/murderer she'd be far more distraught.
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NeoElfboy posted...

I dunno if I'd call it trolling but you can label it that if you want? Regardless, she's not serious about her accusation

then that would be trolling since she actually forces him to "prove" his innocence before she'll let him do anything

it's not a simple "you did it didn't you LOL just kidding"
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My least favorite thing about AAI is Franziska whipping Edgeworth constantly after she never does in 3-5 (outside of pressing about the bath, which you can avoid).
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starting the dreaded 6-6

I can already tell ellen's animations are going to be a problem
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LeonhartFour posted...

NeoElfboy posted...

I dunno if I'd call it trolling but you can label it that if you want? Regardless, she's not serious about her accusation

then that would be trolling since she actually forces him to "prove" his innocence before she'll let him do anything

it's not a simple "you did it didn't you LOL just kidding"

I mean trolling isn't a word with a precise definition but I generally understand it to mean "deliberately trying to get someone angry", which doesn't describe the situation here.
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She tells one of the officers that Edgeworth isn't allowed to investigate or enter certain areas because she says so.

Like if you're just stuck on defending her against terminology you don't agree with then whatever I don't care

The point is that it's an annoying and pointless waste of time
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Hey, I can't argue with what you personally find annoying. All I can say is I disagree.

At this point if there's nothing left to argue but personal feelings then we might as well move on.
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Edgeworth putting it all together as Lablanc falls over the railing in slow motion as Announce the Truth plays is definitely the best part of this case.
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also I like that Gumshoe is the only person who is concerned about Lablanc's well being as Edgeworth and Franziska calmly discuss that Hicks fell to his death from the top of the stairs
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the mark of a true Ace Attorney hardcore investigator is still trying to examine and talk to everyone even as Hicks's cell phone rings incessantly

that was rough
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E1-2 complete!

Total lines by character:

1. Phoenix Wright - 15074
2. Miles Edgeworth - 4919
3. Maya Fey - 4441
4. The Judge - 3845
5. Dick Gumshoe - 2707
6. Franziska von Karma - 1654
7. Mia Fey - 1418
8. Ema Skye - 1150
9. Pearl Fey - 1035
10. Godot - 902
11. Larry Butz - 683
12. Dahlia Hawthorne - 578
13. Adrian Andrews - 459
14. Wendy Oldbag - 443
15. Lotta Hart - 437
16. The Judge's Brother - 421
17. Bikini - 351
18. Will Powers - 329
19. Lawrence "Moe" Curls - 320
20. Manfred von Karma - 316
21. Winston Payne - 299
22. Luke Atmey - 292
23. Damon Gant - 285
24. Ini Miney - 275
25. Angel Starr - 272
26. Ron DeLite - 269
27. Rhoda Teneiro - 267
28. Maggey Byrde - 257
29. Jake Marshall - 257
30. Calisto Yew - 256
31. Jean Armstrong - 251
32. Lana Skye - 249
33. Victor Kudo - 247
34. Tyrell Badd - 242
35. Marvin Grossberg - 234
36. Shelly de Killer - 219
37. Maximillion Galactica - 203
38. Ben & Trilo Quist - 200
39. Ken "Acro" Dingling - 182
40. Iris - 181
41. Furio Tigre - 176
42. Matt Engarde - 171
43. Cammy Meele - 168
44. Morgan Fey - 165
45. Redd White - 162
46. Regina Berry - 151
47. Dee Vasquez - 148
48. Zinc Lablanc - 145
49. Trilo Quist - 140
50. Desiree DeLite - 139
51. Cody Hackins - 135
52. Mike Meekins - 128
53. Richard Wellington - 107
54. April May - 104
55. Kay Faraday - 99
56. Yanni Yogi - 98
57. Penny Nichols - 86
58. Viola Cadaverini - 80
59. Terry Fawles - 74
60. Director Hotti - 71
61. Benjamin Woodman - 60
62. Sal Manella - 59
63. Frank Sahwit - 58
64. The Bellboy - 57
65. Chief of Detectives - 53
66. Lisa Basil - 46
67. Turner Grey - 39
68. Elise Deauxnim - 30
69. Polly - 20
70. Gregory Edgeworth - 5
71. Ernest Amano - 3
72. Shi-Long Lang - 3

Overall total lines - 49482

Total lines by segment:

E1-2 Beginning - 788
E1-2 End - 670
E1-2 Middle - 537

Total lines by case:

2-4 - 5946
1-5 - 5913
3-5 - 5815
3-2 - 4151
3-3 - 4063
2-3 - 3884
1-4 - 3466
2-2 - 3119
E1-4 - 2935
1-3 - 2741
E1-2 - 1995
1-2 - 1773
3-4 - 1225
3-1 - 1167
2-2 - 899
1-1 - 389

Total lines by character per case:

Turnabout Airlines (E1-2)

Miles Edgeworth - 936 (46.92%)
Rhoda Teneiro - 267 (13.38%)
Franziska von Karma - 217 (10.88%)
Dick Gumshoe - 201 (10.08%)
Cammy Meele - 168 (8.42%)
Zinc Lablanc - 145 (7.27%)
Other - 56
Ernest Amano - 3
Sal Manella - 2

Total lines by character per game:

Ace Attorney Investigations

1. Miles Edgeworth - 2264
2. Franziska von Karma - 736
3. Dick Gumshoe - 444
4. Rhoda Teneiro - 267
5. Calisto Yew - 256
6. Tyrell Badd - 242
7. Cammy Meele - 168
8. Zinc Lablanc - 145
9. The Judge - 132
10. Kay Faraday - 99
11. Other - 92
12. Manfred von Karma - 68
13. Mack Rell - 5
14. Shi-Long Lang - 3
15. Ernest Amano - 3
16. Byrne Faraday - 2
17. Manny Coachen - 2
18. Sal Manella - 2

Looks like E1-2 is now our record-holder for highest percentage of lines by one character. Poor Gumshoe never gets a chance to get a word in edgewise once things get serious.
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Yeah, E1-2 was the only case I could have seen being the record holder for percentage, and it was. I think it's going to stay that way, no other case can compete, I'm pretty sure.

I know Rhoda kinda acts as your "partner" for part of the case but it's still surprising to see a case-specific supporting character like her have such a high line %.

LeonhartFour posted...

Edgeworth putting it all together as Lablanc falls over the railing in slow motion as Announce the Truth plays is definitely the best part of this case.

Yeah it's pretty great. AAI's Announce the Truth theme is so good.

LeonhartFour posted...

Poor Gumshoe never gets a chance to get a word in edgewise once things get serious.

I see what you did there.
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Paratroopa1 posted...

Yeah, E1-2 was the only case I could have seen being the record holder for percentage, and it was. I think it's going to stay that way, no other case can compete, I'm pretty sure.

Yeah, I can't see any other case competing now that Kay and Ray will be the assistants in AAI from here on out, and they've always got plenty to say. Pretty sure you've always got a partner with you during investigations in DD and SoJ, too, so not much chance there either. I don't think Apollo ever investigates alone in AJ either. I think the only solo investigation section there is the MASON System.
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Also, E1-2's conclusion is kind of weird because Cammy doesn't have any testimonies after she "gets serious," and they use the Presto theme for the final contradiction, but it's with the picture from Hicks's phone, not from her testimony.

E1-3's conclusion is kind of the same way because the final testimony comes before the haunted house recreation, so you go a while after the final testimony before Lance finally breaks down, but at least he gets Presto for it.
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Other, huh
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"Other" is a big category in AAI since there are so many random, nameless people all over the place.
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I really like the confrontation with Cammy Meele in E1-2 - it's short but sweet

Paratroopa1 posted...

I really like the confrontation with Cammy Meele in E1-2 - it's short but sweet

This post made me sad. The only case you can really characterize as "short but sweet" in any sense in AA5 or 6 is 6-6 - and it's lacking in a way that actually makes you want more.
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5-4 Day 1 absolutely fits the bill there.
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5-4 taken alone just stretches the definition of a "case" like never before, so labeling it short but sweet requires a bit of an asterisk.

I think 6-4 is short but sweet but I know not everyone shares that opinion!
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I mean overall E1-2 is still one of my least favorite cases - but I think the last segment, everything from the part where Leblanc falls down to the Meele confrontation, has pretty good kick to it. Really like the last contradiction with the Borginian cloth, very clever.

NeoElfboy posted...

5-4 taken alone just stretches the definition of a "case" like never before, so labeling it short but sweet requires a bit of an asterisk.

I think 6-4 is short but sweet but I know not everyone shares that opinion!

for a trial-only case 6-4 isn't very short

5-4 is unorthodox in terms of format (although really the only thing that sets it apart is that it doesn't end with you catching the killer, which is a big deal with AA, admittedly), but it still concludes with a Not Guilty verdict so it's not really stretching the definition that much.

besides I was just talking about the Apollo/Blackquill part of 5-4 which actually is pretty short
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fun fact the only trial days longer than 6-4 are L-4, 6-5 day 2, 5-5, L-3, and 3-5 day 2 (by literally less than a minute)
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5-4 day 1 doesn't provide closure, though. it ends on a dumb cliffhanger that we already know is coming. it's a nice segment but it's not really the same thing.

6-4 isn't all terrible, but short-and-sweet is not a way i would characterize it

i guess you could describe the final confrontation as concise, though
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SeabassDebeste posted...

it's a nice segment but it's not really the same thing.

I mean that's exactly what Para was talking about

he's talking about a piece of a case not the whole thing
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also if you want other "short but sweet" spots in DD there's post-transformation Rimes's testimony in 5-6, Apollo's cross-examination in 5-5, recreating the statue in 5-3, calling Tonate's bluff in 5-1, and the Forbidden Chamber in 5-2

in SoJ there's investigating the office with Maya in 6-6, the Phoenix/Edgeworth investigation segment in 6-5, cross-examining Owen in 6-4, Datz's Psyche-Lock in 6-3, Retinz repoing the WAA in 6-2, and the Amatagam Key in 6-1
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sweet maybe, but none of those felt brief to me at all.
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those things are all pretty brief unless your definition of brief is like less than 5 minutes

The Phoenix/Edgeworth thing is probably the only one that takes more than 10-15 minutes, but compared to the rest of 6-5, it's a pretty small chunk of the case.

so perhaps the only short and sweet thing to you in the entire series is just 1-1
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I love E1-3's intro. Really good music and a cool setpiece inside the haunted house. Also, I love the fact that Edgeworth uses Rhoda's hideous suitcase to put the money in. Dude has no sentimentality whatsoever.
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well everything in AA1 is brief

3-2's trials are brief

and for their magnitude, i think the endings of E1-4, E2-1, E2-3, and E2-5 are pretty brief

i actually do agree with most of those AA6 ones after rereading (except owen; gehru would probably be a better pick) - and 6-1, which is hilarious but monstrously long for an intro case)

i enjoy E1-3 a lot as a case overall!
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The Owen testimony is shorter than Geiru's, since it's just a relatively quick Mood Matrix.

also it depends on what you consider an "ending" because the epilogue of most cases is brief after you catch the killer

like if you're talking about the showdown with the killer those are all fairly beefy parts of the case
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Am I right in thinking that 6-6 has the first instance of the word "sex" being used in any meaning or context in the series (in this case, talking about the cow and bull lanterns)? I know this is a bizarre thing to notice

Also, is there an article on "sex" in the ace attorney wiki? This is important
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Well, the issue of sex/gender has come up in several cases, so it's not out of the realm of possibility it's been used in that context before, such as with Adrian Andrews.
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E1-3 Beginning complete!

NOT SO FAST
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